It's the thread you know you needed: 12 weights

[Wis-Mallard]

The % difference from 102 and 109 is 6.64%. Light heavyweight at 230 and 285 is 21.36%. An 88 pond kid is 21.32% different than a 109 pounder.

Just think of poor 220 moved up to wrestle heavyweight. I know the big guys have some fluff that is a huge difference.

Lol yea if your HWT is 285 there aren't many that are. Plus your talking about bumping a 220 up. Of course the percentage is going to be higher. Great argument 

A 233 pound heavyweight is 7.04% different than a 250 heavyweight. So we typically have some weight differences at more than just 106. I'm simply pointing out that there are other situations where a guy has to wrestle bigger guys. If you have two 190 pound kids and no 220 one kid has to wrestle 220 and give up weight.   

Keeping the lowest weight low also creates incentives to cheat the system and have big weight cuts to make sure you can fill all the weights or win a state title at a weight dominated by freshman and sophomores. If everything has to be fair for every kid that steps on the mat why not bring back 98 pounds?

[wrastle63]

Even at 19 years old 220 is 95th percentile according to CDC whereas 15 year olds which is part way through freshman year would be at 20th percentile for 106. An 18 year old at 5th percentile is 115. That's basically 112. Yea let's skew the numbers heavier....

[MNbadger]

10% of 15 year olds (high school freshmen) are under 100 pounds.
You can push the weights up by as many pounds as you like, the same cutting will continue.  That was the flawed logic the last tome it was done and we are still claiming it is an issue

Here is data (the curve you asked for).
We are choosing to throw away a good percentage of potential wrestlers.
https://www.cdc.gov/growthcharts/data/set1clinical/cj41c021.pdf

The first 3 weights in college are very small for an adult so it makes sense that they were at 106 as a freshman in high school.

I am actually surprised that there is not more of a push to move the college weights up a bit especially with all the weight cutting and worrying about managing number of weigh-ins in a season.  I think college wrestling could benefit by bumping up all weights 5 or 6 lbs except heavyweight.

I would not be against lowering heavyweight to 265. What percentage of our present heavyweights are above 265 or can't cut to 265?  I would like to see the bell curve for weight of guys just wrestling heavyweight.

5% of 16 years old weigh less than 105.
5% of 17 year olds weigh less that 110
About 2% of 18 year olds weigh less than 112

All those kids would fit nicely in a 112 lb weight class...
**Even more so if there was no growth allowance
**Even more so if there was mat side weigh-ins
**Even more so if a wrestler had to weigh in below 112 for over 50% of his weigh-ins to be eligible to wrestle that weight class in state tournament series

[Numbers]

I realize only the most passionate visit this board.  Why do we stress about the lowest weight class?

Not every freshman should be a varsity wrestler.  Some really good wrestlers might not make state as a freshman if they only weigh 96 pounds.  That is okay.  They may place at state as a sophomore.

Not being able to field a full team is an issue.  Forfeits are really bad for the sport.

13 weight classes is a step in the right direction.

[MNbadger]

Well said.

Anyone that doesn't understand why we have or why we need 14 weight classes does not understand how wrestling or high school sports work.

First we have to understand that wrestling is not a team sport but we try and function like a team sport!!!
Example - The dumbest FF solution I hear is "go to college weights and 3 weights below" with this logic applied to other sports then linebacker's in HS would all weigh 235 and they would be 6'3 just like in college, and in Basketball HS point guards would all be 6'4 like in college?
In team sport they have positions that are not determined by size or weight and kids slowly grow in to these positions between their  freshman year and potentially through college years as well. So a 5'8 135 pound freshman playing linebacker will likely be 5'11 and 185lbs his senior year and still playing linebacker. In team sports they don't need to worry about the bell curve of growth because you do not need to be a size or weight to play any position, they typically find a way to get the best kids on the field,court,rink.
Because wrestling is not a team sport we have 14 weight classes to take into account the 4 bell curves.
The average freshman weigh's 135 so the bell curve would be from 105-160.
The average sophomore weighs 160 so the bell curve would be from 132 - 195
The average junior weighs 170 so the bell curve would be from 145 - 220
The average senior weighs 180 so the bell curve would be from 152 - HWT.
I guess if we are inappropriate term3 bent on forcing wrestling to look like a team sport with duals (duals are fun) then we need to understand FF are a necessary part of the sport to allow for the natural growth pattern. Or Wisconsin could do what other states have done to maintain participation numbers and co-op, or spend more time building a k-12 program.

[wrastle63]

I realize only the most passionate visit this board.  Why do we stress about the lowest weight class?

Not every freshman should be a varsity wrestler.  Some really good wrestlers might not make state as a freshman if they only weigh 96 pounds.  That is okay.  They may place at state as a sophomore.

Not being able to field a full team is an issue.  Forfeits are really bad for the sport.

13 weight classes is a step in the right direction.

Not a single person on here said every freshman should be varsity. Your point about forfeits being really bad actually explains my point. Hey Numbers look at the numbers! There are more kids under 110 in HS than their are above 200 according to the CDC. Yet we have 2 weight classes above 200. Even as a 20 year old the 95th percentile is only 210. But yea keep bumping the weights up further it makes ZERO sense.

[factfinder]

I realize only the most passionate visit this board.  Why do we stress about the lowest weight class?

Not every freshman should be a varsity wrestler.  Some really good wrestlers might not make state as a freshman if they only weigh 96 pounds.  That is okay.  They may place at state as a sophomore.

Not being able to field a full team is an issue.  Forfeits are really bad for the sport.

13 weight classes is a step in the right direction.

Look at your messages.
Not a single person on here said every freshman should be varsity. Your point about forfeits being really bad actually explains my point. Hey Numbers look at the numbers! There are more kids under 110 in HS than their are above 200 according to the CDC. Yet we have 2 weight classes above 200. Even as a 20 year old the 95th percentile is only 210. But yea keep bumping the weights up further it makes ZERO sense.

[littleguy301]

Now it has been posted some where that since we went to 14 weight classes the number of kids that have come out has gone up.

If that is true, I certainly dont want to cut any weight classes!

People, get rid of the 7/7 and try to get a dual with a team that is in your same boat.

For all the people out here that want to drop weights, what if you were in duals with teams like your teams. Both teams had a couple of ff but the rest matched up real good and you had duals.

Should tennis cut back due to lack of kids? They dont but has anyone ever been to a high school tennis meet. Same goes for cross country, golf and other sports.

[littleguy301]

I would bet a school that has problems filling out a wrestling line up has a problem filling out a full line up in another sport also.

Now I could be wrong but I read in girls hockey there is well over 200 schools that are in evolved with girls hockey but yet they only field 90 plus teams. Lots of co ops and sounds like not alot of numbers either. I dont hear that hockey wants to reduce to 5 players on a team. Heck they split into 2 divisions! More teams at state!

I could be wrong but schools dropped from 11 to 9 man football. I still hear numbers are dropping.

While I understand because I was all for dropping weights not so long ago. I now believe in the idea of giving every one a chance and do not want to take away anything because you never get it back.

Lot at the up rear in the Olympics taking away weights. I seriously doubt we ever have more than 6 weights again. Wouldn't it have been nice to have dake, Taylor and a few more on the last Olympic team. Gosh the medals!

[Ghetto]

Now it has been posted some where that since we went to 14 weight classes the number of kids that have come out has gone up.

If that is true, I certainly dont want to cut any weight classes!

People, get rid of the 7/7 and try to get a dual with a team that is in your same boat.

For all the people out here that want to drop weights, what if you were in duals with teams like your teams. Both teams had a couple of ff but the rest matched up real good and you had duals.

This assumes that you have kids at the same weights

Should tennis cut back due to lack of kids? They dont but has anyone ever been to a high school tennis meet. Same goes for cross country, golf and other sports.

Tennis can put 5 kids of any size on the court. There are no weight classes. Same with every other sport. Our sport is unique in that aspect. Can't really compare.

[Wis-Mallard]

The proposed changes get rid of big guy and are a very minor shift in the rest of the weights towards the middle. Going from 13 to 14 weights is that no that big of a deal. Going from 10 to 6 in the Olympics really sucks.

[The wrestler]

Now I could be wrong little guy. lm not understanding why a team would spend time looking for other teams that have as many ff as your team. That's not what teams look for. They look for better teams to wrestle and set goals for a team championship at the end. Our coach is not in this sport to get a partisapation ribbon. Why is a team satisfied with ff and looking for a team you can beat all the time. We are looking for all teams to be a competitive team not any less. Almost every year our team can only put 13 on the mat. We manage but when it gets to the end of the year it's hard to win and make it to team state. All the numbers and stats we put together isn't going to change the problem we have. Look at tournaments when they ask for 16 teams and if they have 20 teams you still can't fill a 16 man brackets. I'm not saying this is going to solve all the problems we have but this is a start moving to 13. Sometimes I wonder if we are all watching the same movie so to speak. The only time they have a full brackets is at sectionals. WIAA please do something and listen to the fans.

[factfinder]

Factfinder for sure you don't know the facts. Wrestling is not a team sport if you only have 9 wrestlers but put 13 on the mat and then you have a team. WRONG statement sir. That's what this post is all about. I'm guessing your team has never made it to team state because those boys that are not going to make it out of sectionals are good enough as a team to win a state championship. Some teams might come out of Individual state with only one state champ but can compete for a Team State Title. And for those people don't think a Team Title isn't the same your wrong. A team title means that your team has 14 champs on one team. That's what we are trying to do here people. As the old saying goes less is more.

My son's team has won state two years in a row and is favored to win again next year, They are ranked in the top ten in the nation. I guess I don't get your point? In Wisconsin your team makes team state based on how they do at an individual tournament (regionals).

[littleguy301]

Now it has been posted some where that since we went to 14 weight classes the number of kids that have come out has gone up.

If that is true, I certainly dont want to cut any weight classes!

People, get rid of the 7/7 and try to get a dual with a team that is in your same boat.

For all the people out here that want to drop weights, what if you were in duals with teams like your teams. Both teams had a couple of ff but the rest matched up real good and you had duals.

This assumes that you have kids at the same weights

Should tennis cut back due to lack of kids? They dont but has anyone ever been to a high school tennis meet. Same goes for cross country, golf and other sports.

Tennis can put 5 kids of any size on the court. There are no weight classes. Same with every other sport. Our sport is unique in that aspect. Can't really compare.

well I dont know my tennis that well but isnt there 7 matches contested in a meet?

4 singles and 3 doubles. that would make they need 10 kids. Many school do not field an entire team of 4 singles and 3 doubles but I dont hear tennis people talking about cutting down.

find a team that works for you with kids at around the same weights.

[littleguy301]

Now I could be wrong little guy. lm not understanding why a team would spend time looking for other teams that have as many ff as your team. That's not what teams look for. They look for better teams to wrestle and set goals for a team championship at the end. Our coach is not in this sport to get a partisapation ribbon. Why is a team satisfied with ff and looking for a team you can beat all the time. We are looking for all teams to be a competitive team not any less. Almost every year our team can only put 13 on the mat. We manage but when it gets to the end of the year it's hard to win and make it to team state. All the numbers and stats we put together isn't going to change the problem we have. Look at tournaments when they ask for 16 teams and if they have 20 teams you still can't fill a 16 man brackets. I'm not saying this is going to solve all the problems we have but this is a start moving to 13. Sometimes I wonder if we are all watching the same movie so to speak. The only time they have a full brackets is at sectionals. WIAA please do something and listen to the fans.

you want the WIAA to do something and you dont want to do it your self.

so your saying your coach is lazy then,

send out emails, post on this forum and ask around to see if there is teams that match what you have.

dont look for teams your going to mop up on look for teams that are in your boat and will be good for you.

example: if you have a team of 12 kids that fill out 11 weights look and see if there is another team in your boat with weights around the same as yours. We all spend time on track wrestling looking at track records look to see what those teams have.

if there is no 7/7 rule

example: then if you have a team of 6 kids look for getting mainly into tournaments to get those kids matches. sure it sucks not to have a home dual but put your wrestlers in the best spot.

look to co-op. dont play the victum card, swallow your ego and co-op with a school that makes sense.

bottom line is dont let the WIAA solve your problems because it isnt going to work very well overall for most involved.