Stratford

[shouldvewrestled]

D1 isn't weighted.  It is scored like any other wrestling individual tournament.  D1 just has more matches where you can score more points as the D2/D3 sectional winners don't get bye points for not having to wrestle first round if they win their next match.  D1 is usually deeper talent pool so overall more depth with more schools with larger enrollment to pick from and "harder" to put many into the semis and finals for one school.

[shouldvewrestled]

Looking at that LC team from 2005 on track, they matched up very well with this Stratford team in a dual if they could spread a few of their top guys out weight wise as the weights were distributed very differently then.

That 2012 rapids team was murderers row from 132-195 basically.  Could Stratford steal one in there in a dual (Kaufmann is no for sure versus Lubeck or Raflik)?  Would be two fun duals for sure to watch.

[wrestling123]

Not sure it is accurate comparison as others have said for 2005 to now, but one could also argue that Stratford would have scored even more points if their 113 hadn't broken his hand before regionals. As we all know, he was a serious candidate to wrestle in the championship match. Could play devils advocate and even say what happens if they all bump up a weight and you add in a Kilty. Do they get stronger in dual format....I think they sure do!

I also don't get all the hate on D3 schools. Year in and year out they are just as competitive as the other divisions. You see it at all the major tournaments around the state. Do they typically have the quality of depth no, but I think D3 holds its own this year just fine if the D1/2/3 weight class champions wrestled in round robin format.

[shouldvewrestled]

Not sure it is accurate comparison as others have said for 2005 to now, but one could also argue that Stratford would have scored even more points if their 113 hadn't broken his hand before regionals. As we all know, he was a serious candidate to wrestle in the championship match. Could play devils advocate and even say what happens if they all bump up a weight and you add in a Kilty. Do they get stronger in dual format....I think they sure do!

I also don't get all the hate on D3 schools. Year in and year out they are just as competitive as the other divisions. You see it at all the major tournaments around the state. Do they typically have the quality of depth no, but I think D3 holds its own this year just fine if the D1/2/3 weight class champions wrestled in round robin format.

Not sure it is a hate on D3.  I'm a big D2/D3 guy and agree the top placers in D2/D3 could for sure hold their own and even win a one division tournament, but overall the D1 depth is much greater.  As for Stratford I will admit they have one of the best teams I've had the chance to watch, but I think it rubs people the wrong way when people make the claim they are for sure the best.  You even made the claim even better "IF" they add a Kilty.  She's not there, the shoulda, woulda, coulda's are fun speculation but not reality.  Best of luck to Stratford in getting that so far elusive team title.  Wish them well but have a personal connection to another team and will be rooting for them, but not against Stratford so to say.

[OneEyedFatMan]

Hard to argue vs those Athens teams. Hard not to be impressed.

Stoughton should win the D-1 team title this year- loaded!

Whoa, i just said i think Stratford is the best team in the state right now. I dont mind if you have different opinions.

Stoughton did win the dual, i understand. i love Stoughton, im rooting for them against KK.

Athens had some sweet teams man. Take her easy here.

[thequad]

I don't know where you got the 149 points for LC but 23 more points is almost impossible when you consider how similar the placements are! As I remember it was much more than that, but I have no way to prove that since I don't know how to find the team scores. Also that big of a win over Apple Valley was a huge win over one of Minnesota's best teams at the time.

[shouldvewrestled]

I don't know where you got the 149 points for LC but 23 more points is almost impossible when you consider how similar the placements are! As I remember it was much more than that, but I have no way to prove that since I don't know how to find the team scores. Also that big of a win over Apple Valley was a huge win over one of Minnesota's best teams at the time.

Trackwrestling has the 2005 WIAA Individual State if you search for it and has LC at 149.  With how similar their placings were it is weird to see that wide a margin but I think it is mostly with Stratfords two Quarterfinal losers wrestling back to the 3rd place match being 10 points right there and then LC's 4th placers not get the extra match to score advancement and mat points is where the margin is.  
2005 LC scored 12 mat points
2017 Stratford scored 22 mat points is also where some of the margin is.

[wrastle63]

Biggest thing is Stratford could have arguably had another champion at 113. He took 2nd at Bi-State and lost to Bailey from Sparta 4-3.

[shouldvewrestled]

Biggest thing is Stratford could have arguably had another champion at 113. He took 2nd at Bi-State and lost to Bailey from Sparta 4-3.

But wasn't there.  LC might have had injuries too we forget about.

[Ivan Stankowski]

Athens back in the day was the "Chuck Norris" of wrestling, no one would have touched them, not Stratford, Not WR, Not Vesper, not Big House, not Ellsworth or LC!!!

[bigoil]

Athens back in the day was the "Chuck Norris" of wrestling, no one would have touched them, not Stratford, Not WR, Not Vesper, not Big House, not Ellsworth or LC!!!

Some Rapids faithful will need to back this up but I recall them boasting that the year Athens took 2nd at the Ironman, Rapids beat them in a dual meet.

Sledgehammer, you lurking out there? BigAir? Beanertimm?

[oldfan]

I have known Bob Preusse for quite a few years , I brought this up to him and he says that Athens was in a ToC type tournament and it wasn't the official Ironman that is held at Walsh Jesuit High School in Cuyahoga Falls Ohio . He showed me every program from back in the day and they were not in there . Scott Kluever also knows Bob and can confirm or deny this . He also claims the name of the event Scott runs was his idea when he was sitting around drinking with Scott and Billy Barger .

[MarkK]

I have known Bob Preusse for quite a few years , I brought this up to him and he says that Athens was in a ToC type tournament and it wasn't the official Ironman that is held at Walsh Jesuit High School in Cuyahoga Falls Ohio . He showed me every program from back in the day and they were not in there . Scott Kluever also knows Bob and can confirm or deny this . He also claims the name of the event Scott runs was his idea when he was sitting around drinking with Scott and Billy Barger .

Here is a program with every winner from the Ironman.  No mention of Athens in it., http://walshjesuitironman.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/23271-Walsh-Jesuit-Ironman-2016-WEB.pdf

I think this program shatters the Myth.

[handsandtoes]

Your program won't come up when i click on it? But I don't understand why people turn things into what they want them to say. You are correct you won't find Athens in the champions list. THEY TOOK SECOND! Walsh Jesuit won it. It was around 1992 somewhere in there. Not sure what it was called but it was a very big national tournament. I am sure one of the Athens team alum has way more info then I do and will chime in sooner or later. It was in every paper including the cross face and it was a very big deal back then because Athens only had around 200 kids in their entire school and the next closest school had over 1000. As for Rapids beating Athens in a dual I am pretty sure Jerry Wagner never lost a dual meet to Lewis Benitz.
Here is my top  teams ever.
4) 2012 Rapids team
3) 2005 LC Team
2) Early 80's Mineral Point team
1) Athens 90's team

[oldfan]

Bob showed me the programs with all the teams entered , Athens did go to the Cleveland area and finished second to most likely to Walsh Jesuit but it wasn't the Walsh Ironman . Now it could have been to to the Medina Tournament which was huge back then.

One of you really bright fellows maybe can answer this , how can Athens own website have a now broken link to Milwaukee Journal article about being #2 in the country dated 12/20/1993  and the

1993-1994 team was ranked second  when


the very first Walsh Ironman was held on 12/17/1994, the next year which was 1994-1995 .