Rules to help keep kids enjoying and involved in wrestling?

[ramjet]

5.) Collaboration and training exchanging ideas on how to accomplish this.

[imnofish]

5.) Collaboration and training exchanging ideas on how to accomplish this.

Good point.  For me, it was a matter of being creative and making up games/activities that created excitement, while putting kids in position to practice key skills, etc.  The same can be done with conditioning, reactions, etc.  A number of these activities already have been around for years and could be shared among coaches at these exchanges.  Perhaps these can be accomplished through associations, clubs, and camps that already exist. 

[bigG]

Just like wrestling, there are infinite options to keeping practices fun but intense.

[Handles II]

#5. I understand how having fun works, what I meant is having "fun" would be a pretty difficult "rule" to put in place.

Kind of tragic that none of the other ideas people have put forth as reasons (many of these things have been identified dozens if not hundreds of times) why kids quit can't or won't be implemented. Zero discussion on actually doing anything as a whole for our sport.  How in the world could parents (some who are most certainly also wrestling parents) from other sports come up with incremental/developmental rules to keep kids involved, but in this sport we would just rather keep things the same  and keep watching our numbers fall rather than at least trying things that in the least, won't cause more damage.  It's a shame, isn't it?

[wrastle63]

1. Parents in stands (or very limited on floor)
2. Starting kids later in the sport/No tournaments except possibly duals k-2


These are the important ones. Coaches coach parents cheer will help the kids and the wrestlers. Less tournaments and more duals.

[Coach V]

Well Handles,,,, Then what's your ideas??? what are your sweeping changes to make wrestling the most participated sport out there.

[imnofish]

1. Parents in stands (or very limited on floor)
2. Starting kids later in the sport/No tournaments except possibly duals k-2


These are the important ones. Coaches coach parents cheer will help the kids and the wrestlers. Less tournaments and more duals.

All are definitely worth considering. 

[Handles II]

Well Handles,,,, Then what's your ideas??? what are your sweeping changes to make wrestling the most participated sport out there.

These aren't my ideas. These ideas have been identified discussed for at least a decade or more by multiple people, parents and coaches at every level, in multiple communities and states. These are well-known issues within our sport. Aside from your sarcasm, I don't expect that this become the most participated sport out there. But wouldn't it be nice if it grew in our state?

The WWF is our governing body, but they really only govern the "state series" regarding folkstyle youth wrestling. While they lead by example in eliminating the youngest wrestlers from competing (Hmm?), requiring coaching certification, and only 1 additional adult per wrestler, outside of that atmosphere this isn't implemented for club tournaments. Why are those rules/guidelines good for the state series, but not a part of the overall group? Part of that problem is that our WWF is simply part of USA Wrestling.  USA Wrestling is hands off for youth folkstyle.  Unlike other sports, where at both the national and state level, developmental rules are implemented for the good of the sport, in wrestling there are essentially none.

Profit. Youth tournaments are designed as money makers, not really designed in the best interest of the kids or the sport.  Eliminating k-2 would be eliminating the largest number of entrants per year class the "base" of a money-making pyramid if you will. Nobody wants to actually change because it would affect their bottom line.  Wrestling clubs were once designed to teach kids about the sport and lead them into HS wrestling. Many clubs didn't start until 4th grade or older, and there were very few tournaments. Once profit became the driving force, all of that changed.  Again, unless this would come from WWF, like they do at State, it is unlikely to change.

So what can be done? Two things, make changes locally while urging them to happen at a state/national level. Contact your reps, your boards. Ask them why they aren't  implementing developmental rules and guidelines like Little League or USA Hockey, USA Soccer as well as local youth organizations do, to help keep as many kids in the sport as possible as long as possible.

[ramjet]

#5. I understand how having fun works, what I meant is having "fun" would be a pretty difficult "rule" to put in place.

Kind of tragic that none of the other ideas people have put forth as reasons (many of these things have been identified dozens if not hundreds of times) why kids quit can't or won't be implemented. Zero discussion on actually doing anything as a whole for our sport.  How in the world could parents (some who are most certainly also wrestling parents) from other sports come up with incremental/developmental rules to keep kids involved, but in this sport we would just rather keep things the same  and keep watching our numbers fall rather than at least trying things that in the least, won't cause more damage.  It's a shame, isn't it?

Again "rules" are not the only way to impliment positive change. Culture also is important and has more lasting affects than just "rules" . Sure some changes might help but without the cultural changes you not see huge changes or drops in those quitting.

[Coach V]

Funny you should say that about contacting the WWF. Matt Verbeten from Wrightstown. I am the District 7 rep. Your thoughts are being heard and I agree with some of them. Careful what you ask for in having someone telling how to do everything. Look at the WIAA. Some good, some challenging.The WWF is involved in all aspects. High school-Challenge series, an event that has worked very well and has a girls division, training teams, Freco state, Northern plains, Central Regional, UWW, national duals, Fargo. Middle school and youth- we all know about the tournament series, school boy and girl opportunities in freestyle and greco, training and competing.

I agree totally on the youth tournaments. Money. I tried to get our changed and i'm still working on it. We have a scrimmage with an area team and some local duals for k-2. Shortened practices to 1 hour. Its hard for parents to wait to have kids compete. Plenty of studies/examples that show early youth success doesn't always lead to later success. Thinking about summer play time on the mats for kids and see if anyone shows up. People are SUPER busy.

I think wrestling needs to get fans. How do we get fans to come?The competing part isn't for everyone. Can we find ways to make it more fun as Cael says, yes. wrestling requires HARD training to be successful. Hard is fun, fun is hard. Make duals so kids want to either come and watch or join and compete, but it will still be hard. Its just you out there.

I agree on we should always be looking to make wrestling better. It starts with each of us. Are we doing what we can at a local level? Or are we the background noise that gets annoying? Be willing to be part of the solution even if its not your idea. Help people with what they are working on and improve if and when needed. We will not all agree, but are you willing to help? Do you have to be right or do whats right? Threads like this DO get people thinking and talking wrestling.

We have great leaders at the college level in all divisions that will help if we ask. Clubs and schools have to work together.

[ramjet]

Nice post.

Youth Tournament structure;

1.) Time frames for age and weight groups. You are assigned a time slot to show up and wrestle.
2.) Pre-scheduled based on estimated weights in the lower age groups.
3.) 1 parent mat side with a brief guidelines for proper conduct.


I like the EC area they are using trained resources for coaching. I think it's working but they would have to say if that's the case.


Understand the WWF can only manage if the tournament is sanctioned by the WWF or the clubs are part of said association.

I agree that some rules help but you cannot FORCE people to follow them because their is not consequence other than folks not attending. But will participants can work together for improvment and culture change.

The first step is to define the mission statment or goal.

Have we done this here?

Get more numbers?
Have rentention in wrestling?
Regulate youth wrestling?
Promote dual mets or team spirit in youth wrestling?

[wrastle63]

Nice post.

Youth Tournament structure;

1.) Time frames for age and weight groups. You are assigned a time slot to show up and wrestle.
2.) Pre-scheduled based on estimated weights in the lower age groups.
3.) 1 parent mat side with a brief guidelines for proper conduct.


I like the EC area they are using trained resources for coaching. I think it's working but they would have to say if that's the case.


Understand the WWF can only manage if the tournament is sanctioned by the WWF or the clubs are part of said association.

I agree that some rules help but you cannot FORCE people to follow them because their is not consequence other than folks not attending. But will participants can work together for improvment and culture change.

The first step is to define the mission statment or goal.

Have we done this here?

Get more numbers?
Have rentention in wrestling?
Regulate youth wrestling?
Promote dual mets or team spirit in youth wrestling?

Like the idea of doing different time frames, but you could run into some problems like wait time(not as big of a deal for younger kids), confusion as opposed to everyone show up at 9, etc.

What are trained resources?

[Handles II]

Thanks for the reply and your efforts. It is good that these problems are known, but yes, they do need to be addressed. I'm  aware of all the other aspects of the sport the WWF is involved in, it's our club-level youth tournaments that really seem to be the area where WWF is least involved and where there needs to be the most direction. It's where we get new wrestlers, and lose them at the highest rates.
With due respect for your comparison to the WIAA, the WWF is specific to wrestling. The promotion and advancement of this sport and the kids who are involved is, or should be, it's #1 priority. The WIAA is HS level and multiple sports. Their "job" if you will, isn't to attract and retain kids (or their parents/guardians) in the sport of wrestling. Thus there should be a big difference between the two.
This is why I brought up other sports-centric organizations like USA soccer, Little League, etc. who have all created specific rules designed to protect, attract, and retain kids.

While I agree with Ramjet that a culture change would be fantastic, we need a collective change statewide that comes from leadership. That type of ruling, with penalties for breaking those rules, has certainly changed the culture in these other sports regarding parent expectations and behavior or what ages various aspects of play may begin. Playing rules, pitching rules, checking rules, tackling rules  have all been implemented not for the good of one individual, but to actually change the culture and help the participants and the sport as a whole.
In speaking with my comrades in MN, youth hockey, and hockey in general was really hurting. Fewer and fewer kids were going out or staying in the sport. USA Hockey looked at the situation and made some sweeping changes. It has worked.  I would hope wrestling could at least attempt a few things? At the rate we are losing kids following the status quo, what could it hurt?

[DocWrestling]

Other sports do not have to manage parents like wrestling needs to do.  In other sports there is a clear line from the competition and the fans.  It is way too blurred in wrestling.

Anyone know anything about youth wrestling in Illinois.  I was going to be in Illinois visiting family and thought it might be cool if they could see my youth wrestler compete in a tournament there.  As I looked into it for a short time it seemed that an individual cannot enter a tournament on their own.  Only kids registered by the club/coach were allowed in and the coach submitted the weights.  Is that the way it is?  It looked like there was no way for me to enter my son in a random tournament.  I like this idea if it is true.  Protects the kids from their parents and allows a coach to have more control of competitions, etc.  Makes it more of a team sport than an individual sport

I think we need to downsize things at the youth level so everything can be managed by coaches.  
1) That way we can hold coaches accountable and mandate they have certification.  We can also take away their certification if they act inappropriately.  Coaches are a problem also as they do things that no high school coach could ever get away with.  Give credentials at youth tournaments and only one credentialed coach in each corner.
2)Parents can then be in stands and away from all. Need to step and hold them accountable and eject them if they fail to stay in stands.  They would not be allowed inside the fence or on the field/court in other sports and certainly can never address the officials

The only way this can be done is to downsize tournaments and/or split up age groups.
1) Most tournaments need more seating if we required all parents to sit in stands
2) Youth tournaments should be specific to one age group at a time.  
3) Need bigger mats because that also eases congestion around mats and improves wrestling experience.
4) Tournaments can run long days but only have one age group wrestling at a time so it is manageable with coaches and parents

Youth tournaments other than duals have become minimally controlled chaos with making money the primary factor.  Wrestling clubs need to focus on the experience.

As wrestlers, parents, coaches, and clubs we need to put the sport of wrestling as our first priority rather than our individual wants