NIL

[MTA]

Tons of booster clubs give scholarships for academics, community work, etc. and then the kids can use that for camps.  Legal if it is an open application process with one of the qualifications being you have to be a wrestler.  At least the way it was years ago

As you stated it, that does not conform with current WIAA regulations. As such this needs to be fixed if local clubs are doing that across the state.

[MNbadger]

From The Guillotine;
Couple moves of possible national title contenders the past few days

Teemer to Iowa (supposedly for $500k for the one year) and AJ Ferrari to Bakersfield.

Little further back, Stephen Buchanon chose Iowa for a bucket of cash for his last essentially semester

$500,000 for one season.........

[npope]

Paying high school kids on a "pay for play" metric is simply inappropriate term01 - no matter who else might be doing it. Please, get some sense of perspective and grow up!

[thats2!]

Paying high school kids on a "pay for play" metric is simply inappropriate term01 - no matter who else might be doing it. Please, get some sense of perspective and grow up!

Not sure what you're talking about, what school is paying their athletes to "pay for play?"

[npope]

"NIL at the HS level.." is the topic of the thread - correct?

[thats2!]

"NIL at the HS level.." is the topic of the thread - correct?

Yes it is the topic of the thread. What you and many others clearly think of when it comes to NIL is some high school paying some kid $100000 to come play for them. No high school or booster is going to do that. 1-They don't have that kind of money. 2-even if they do have the money no one is paying a high school athlete in the state Wisconsin that kind of money. But let's say there are a 3-4 booster clubs from all sports across state that pay 3-5  individual kids some serious cash. You would stop those 3-5 kids from getting paid rather then let them get paid and having possibly 1000's of kids have new opportunities put in front of them they would have never been possibly before.

[npope]

"NIL at the HS level.." is the topic of the thread - correct?

Yes it is the topic of the thread. What you and many others clearly think of when it comes to NIL is some high school paying some kid $100000 to come play for them. No high school or booster is going to do that. 1-They don't have that kind of money. 2-even if they do have the money no one is paying a high school athlete in the state Wisconsin that kind of money. But let's say there are a 3-4 booster clubs from all sports across state that pay 3-5  individual kids some serious cash. You would stop those 3-5 kids from getting paid rather then let them get paid and having possibly 1000's of kids have new opportunities put in front of them they would have never been possibly before.

You make flawed assumptions and projections as to what other people are thinking...or at least what I am thinking. Speaking in terms of principles here, any time one competitor has a decided advantage, they increasingly tend to distance themselves from the field because they have a competitive advantage, e.g., a better coach, better facilities, etc. And without open enrollment barriers, high school athletes would tend to gravitate toward the relatively more successful programs (we are seeing in the college wrestling ranks right now). The combination of reduced rules associated with open enrollment and potential funding at other programs will only help the rich get richer and the poor... We have all seen that model in the pros and now in college.

For high school, it doesn't have to be a lot of money but something as simple as some perks or bonuses...or it could be money if the NIL actually makes its way into high school sports. It just takes one local rich sponsor to throw a grand or two at starters on a given team and the flood gates will open - you won't be able to put that genie back into the bottle. Do you know that Dion Sander's kid (Shedeur) that plays quarterback for Colorado makes in excess of a million a year while still a student. Did anyone anticipate that when contemplating the NIL at the college level? So why something similarly (albeit on a smaller scale) occur at the high school level? Is that good for the broader high school sports scene?

Recognizing these trends once the flood gates are open, the pros put salary caps on salaries, limit over all payrolls, etc. Why? Because when money congregates it creates inequities and inequities dissipate the competitive field - soon you only have winners and losers...and the fans of the losers soon lose interest. Without mechanisms to ensure a level-playing field, a given sport will cannibalize itself. The pros know it. Collegiate wrestling is beginning to see it. Collegiate football sees it. Soon you won't see all these schools sponsoring teams but rather, it will only be a select handful.

Why wouldn't you think high school sports would follow a similar path? Not big money? For a high school kid/program, they don't need to operate on such an inflated economic scale - it just takes a modest amount of money from a couple of rich donors that care and are allowed to funnel something like $5,000 or so to some high performers and bingo, you've got the anchors on a championship team. It is no longer about giving young kids a chance to simply compete but rather, it is about winning - all about winning....and money.

I think we can hope for better for our youth; hope for a better and more enduring experience. NIL money is just going to ruin high school sports.

[hornbuckleb]

NIL is Name, Image and Likeness.

Pay to Play is one thing, but making money for name, image and likeness is another.  Kids earning money for a Youtube channel, podcast, running camps, or even selling shirts to me is not much different than a job.

The problem is two fold.  NIL has turned into the wild west for college sports because it is not regulated, so we end up with pay to play.  If it is monitored I don't see the problem.  The problem becomes who is going to monitor where the income is coming from.  WIAA, High School Administration, HS Coaches.  That's the problem.

Both HS kids and College kids should be allowed to "EARN" keyword money to support their training, dreams, and aspirations.  Even if not all of us can agree of what earned means.  Handouts are different.

[MNbadger]

"NIL at the HS level.." is the topic of the thread - correct?

Yes it is the topic of the thread. What you and many others clearly think of when it comes to NIL is some high school paying some kid $100000 to come play for them. No high school or booster is going to do that. 1-They don't have that kind of money. 2-even if they do have the money no one is paying a high school athlete in the state Wisconsin that kind of money. But let's say there are a 3-4 booster clubs from all sports across state that pay 3-5  individual kids some serious cash. You would stop those 3-5 kids from getting paid rather then let them get paid and having possibly 1000's of kids have new opportunities put in front of them they would have never been possibly before.

You make flawed assumptions and projections as to what other people are thinking...or at least what I am thinking. Speaking in terms of principles here, any time one competitor has a decided advantage, they increasingly tend to distance themselves from the field because they have a competitive advantage, e.g., a better coach, better facilities, etc. And without open enrollment barriers, high school athletes would tend to gravitate toward the relatively more successful programs (we are seeing in the college wrestling ranks right now). The combination of reduced rules associated with open enrollment and potential funding at other programs will only help the rich get richer and the poor... We have all seen that model in the pros and now in college.

For high school, it doesn't have to be a lot of money but something as simple as some perks or bonuses...or it could be money if the NIL actually makes its way into high school sports. It just takes one local rich sponsor to throw a grand or two at starters on a given team and the flood gates will open - you won't be able to put that genie back into the bottle. Do you know that Dion Sander's kid (Shedeur) that plays quarterback for Colorado makes in excess of a million a year while still a student. Did anyone anticipate that when contemplating the NIL at the college level? So why something similarly (albeit on a smaller scale) occur at the high school level? Is that good for the broader high school sports scene?

Recognizing these trends once the flood gates are open, the pros put salary caps on salaries, limit over all payrolls, etc. Why? Because when money congregates it creates inequities and inequities dissipate the competitive field - soon you only have winners and losers...and the fans of the losers soon lose interest. Without mechanisms to ensure a level-playing field, a given sport will cannibalize itself. The pros know it. Collegiate wrestling is beginning to see it. Collegiate football sees it. Soon you won't see all these schools sponsoring teams but rather, it will only be a select handful.

Why wouldn't you think high school sports would follow a similar path? Not big money? For a high school kid/program, they don't need to operate on such an inflated economic scale - it just takes a modest amount of money from a couple of rich donors that care and are allowed to funnel something like $5,000 or so to some high performers and bingo, you've got the anchors on a championship team. It is no longer about giving young kids a chance to simply compete but rather, it is about winning - all about winning....and money.

I think we can hope for better for our youth; hope for a better and more enduring experience. NIL money is just going to ruin high school sports.

Well put.

[MNbadger]

NIL is Name, Image and Likeness.

Pay to Play is one thing, but making money for name, image and likeness is another.  Kids earning money for a Youtube channel, podcast, running camps, or even selling shirts to me is not much different than a job.

The problem is two fold.  NIL has turned into the wild west for college sports because it is not regulated, so we end up with pay to play.  If it is monitored I don't see the problem.  The problem becomes who is going to monitor where the income is coming from.  WIAA, High School Administration, HS Coaches.  That's the problem.

Both HS kids and College kids should be allowed to "EARN" keyword money to support their training, dreams, and aspirations.  Even if not all of us can agree of what earned means.  Handouts are different.

It IS pay for play no matter how you slice it.  This is different than a jobat a fast food place or working landscaping which are both unrelated to the given sport.

[DocWrestling]

Putting minors in these spots is just not right.  That means parents have to be involved and more kids are exploited by their parents than anyone elese.  If you don't think kids will start getting cars to use and money then you are naive. Kids from WI are already transferring for many reasons with some even leaving the state.  Some skip high school all together to play club hockey, soccer, etc. 

Basketball will be the most affected because you only need 6-7 guys.  Metro areas will also be the most affected where it is easier when families don't have to move but can attend many different schools.

With the present system 8th and 9th graders will be enticed to certain schools. That already happens but would worsen. NIL does benefit the player/family but destroys the mission and integrity of the organization.  Sports academies would be built and then the WIAA might have to figure out how to kick them out of the WIAA or maybe these academies just want to compete nationally like other academies throughout the US

[Ghetto]

This didn't take long.... Mom suing is North Carolina athletics association over NIL

NIL lawsuit

[hornbuckleb]

NIL is Name, Image and Likeness.

Pay to Play is one thing, but making money for name, image and likeness is another.  Kids earning money for a Youtube channel, podcast, running camps, or even selling shirts to me is not much different than a job.

The problem is two fold.  NIL has turned into the wild west for college sports because it is not regulated, so we end up with pay to play.  If it is monitored I don't see the problem.  The problem becomes who is going to monitor where the income is coming from.  WIAA, High School Administration, HS Coaches.  That's the problem.

Both HS kids and College kids should be allowed to "EARN" keyword money to support their training, dreams, and aspirations.  Even if not all of us can agree of what earned means.  Handouts are different.

It IS pay for play no matter how you slice it.  This is different than a jobat a fast food place or working landscaping which are both unrelated to the given sport.

I agree that it is pay to play if it is not regulated, and without being regulated it is a disaster.  However, I totally disagree with your take that youtube, podcasts, camps or shirts sales is not equivalent to a job landscaping or working fast food.  Thats like saying my job as an engineer is not equivalent to being an educator or vise versa.

Again if regulated I have no problem, but I don't see how it can be at the HS level.

[npope]

I agree that it is pay to play if it is not regulated, and without being regulated it is a disaster.  However, I totally disagree with your take that youtube, podcasts, camps or shirts sales is not equivalent to a job landscaping or working fast food.  Thats like saying my job as an engineer is not equivalent to being an educator or vise versa.

Again if regulated I have no problem, but I don't see how it can be at the HS level.

Just to be clear, you are saying that allowing someone to, for example, use your image on T-shirts they sell and pay you for that usage-right, is equivalent to the athlete having a job as a landscaper? Am I correct in my understanding of your position?

[hornbuckleb]

I agree that it is pay to play if it is not regulated, and without being regulated it is a disaster.  However, I totally disagree with your take that youtube, podcasts, camps or shirts sales is not equivalent to a job landscaping or working fast food.  Thats like saying my job as an engineer is not equivalent to being an educator or vise versa.

Again if regulated I have no problem, but I don't see how it can be at the HS level.

Just to be clear, you are saying that allowing someone to, for example, use your image on T-shirts they sell and pay you for that usage-right, is equivalent to the athlete having a job as a landscaper? Am I correct in my understanding of your position?

No see strike through above and yes I am.

If a HS U17 kid makes the world team they should be able to sell shirts of themself, logo they created, or saying they came up with in order to pay their expenses.

I am also saying that earning money from youtube, twitter or any other form of social media is equivalent to flipping burgers at Culvers on a Sunday afternoon.