Badgers under Bono

[Harris]

This has been a tough year but I really do love the new atmosphere at the field house.  Many more fans, mat side seating, Big Ten coverage, very competitive wrestlers, and an accessible coaching staff if you take the time to get to know them.  I think back to the wrestling matches in the 80's and 90's and it wasn't even close to the level of excitement and attendance I am seeing now.  For that reason alone, I am still very optimistic about the changes, but I also recognize we all want the team to improve from being in the middle of the Big Ten.  Injuries clearly showed a lack of depth at all weights this year.

I think of Penn State's 125 situation.  Why can't the best coaching staff in the country develop a great wrestler at that weight?  If the coaching staff was that great at getting average wrestlers to become elite, they wouldn't have that glaring hole year after year.  Maybe some of the success comes down to being able to recruit the best year in and year out now that they have created a dynasty.  If that is the case, the Badgers have a long way to make up ground with Penn State, Iowa, Michigan, Ohio State and other top tier teams especially if the top club in the state is not supporting the program.  It really is a shame but I think the coaching staff is determined to prove all the haters wrong.  Only time will tell if they succeed or not but it clearly is an uphill battle at this point.  They did seem to have momentum before COVID hit, but then all the progress just vanished.

Regardless of the coach and regardless of the record, I will remain a Wisconsin wrestling fan for life. On Wisconsin!

Congratulations to DJ Hamiti on his Big Ten Championship.  Not many wrestlers can say they were a Big Ten Champ at Wisconsin.  Congrats to all the qualifiers as well.  That alone is also a great accomplishment similar to making it to state in high school.  It makes me laugh at all the criticism considering how hard it is to become a D1 wrestler let alone a qualifier.

On a side note, I am really excited to see what the new coaching staff for the football team can do.

[OneEyedFatMan]

This has been a tough year but I really do love the new atmosphere at the field house.  Many more fans, mat side seating, Big Ten coverage, very competitive wrestlers, and an accessible coaching staff if you take the time to get to know them.  I think back to the wrestling matches in the 80's and 90's and it wasn't even close to the level of excitement and attendance I am seeing now.  For that reason alone, I am still very optimistic about the changes, but I also recognize we all want the team to improve from being in the middle of the Big Ten.  Injuries clearly showed a lack of depth at all weights this year.

I think of Penn State's 125 situation.  Why can't the best coaching staff in the country develop a great wrestler at that weight?  If the coaching staff was that great at getting average wrestlers to become elite, they wouldn't have that glaring hole year after year.  Maybe some of the success comes down to being able to recruit the best year in and year out now that they have created a dynasty.  If that is the case, the Badgers have a long way to make up ground with Penn State, Iowa, Michigan, Ohio State and other top tier teams especially if the top club in the state is not supporting the program.  It really is a shame but I think the coaching staff is determined to prove all the haters wrong.  Only time will tell if they succeed or not but it clearly is an uphill battle at this point.  They did seem to have momentum before COVID hit, but then all the progress just vanished.

Regardless of the coach and regardless of the record, I will remain a Wisconsin wrestling fan for life. On Wisconsin!

Congratulations to DJ Hamiti on his Big Ten Championship.  Not many wrestlers can say they were a Big Ten Champ at Wisconsin.  Congrats to all the qualifiers as well.  That alone is also a great accomplishment similar to making it to state in high school.  It makes me laugh at all the criticism considering how hard it is to become a D1 wrestler let alone a qualifier.

On a side note, I am really excited to see what the new coaching staff for the football team can do.

I've often wondered why Spencer Lee went to Iowa instead of PSU? 

[Crazyotto]

Bono is a used car salesman. Everything sounds great on the lot then you get home and car just doesn't run as planned. Problem is I am not sure its his fault with the resources he has. And its great to call for his job, but who is an upgrade? I will say this, I am souring quickly and this weekend sure didnt help.

[vsmf2010]

Bono is a used car salesman. Everything sounds great on the lot then you get home and car just doesn't run as planned. Problem is I am not sure its his fault with the resources he has. And its great to call for his job, but who is an upgrade? I will say this, I am souring quickly and this weekend sure didnt help.

I am curious what it is about this weekend that made you feel worse. With the exception of Zargo who was plus 4 and Gomez who had injuries to both knees they basically wrestled to seed. Seven to the NCAA's with an 8th if he can wrestle. Two guys wrestled above seed to get an allocation (Lamont and Zargo). Zargo would not have gotten an at large and Lamont would have been on the bubble so that is good. If they wrestled exactly to seed they only get in 6 including Gomez with a possibility of an at large for Lamont.

Wrestler-Seed-Place

Barnett-4-5
Lamont-10-9
Zargo-11-7 (received medical forfeit in 7th place match)
Gomez-2-DNP (injuries to both knees)
Model-9-10 (Medically forfeited in 9th place match)
Hamiti-1-1
Otto-13-(9th to 14th)
Dow-10-11/12
Amos-8-7
Hilger-5-6 (Medically forfeited in 5th place match)

[PAUL]

I get the point vsmf, and it's hard to argue with you.  However, watching on Saturday was very discouraging to me.
 Seeing a number of Minnesota guys overperform and win close matches made me ask myself "why doesn't that ever happen to us....?".  I'll admit that I'm a fan and sometimes fans can have higher expectations than they should.  I'll also admit that the Gomez thing was a punch in the balls.  I'll also admit that Sunday was better than Saturday.  And I'll also admit that it's hard not to be super excited about Hamiti - he looks so darn good and I'm guessing most people LOVE his attitude and style.  That being said, it would be so awesome in 2 weeks to see Hamiti make a strong run at a title and bring 3-4-5 guys along with him to the podium and maybe 2-3 of them beating a few higher seeds ("signature wins") along the way and a top 10 team finish. 

[vsmf2010]

I get the point vsmf, and it's hard to argue with you.  However, watching on Saturday was very discouraging to me.
 Seeing a number of Minnesota guys overperform and win close matches made me ask myself "why doesn't that ever happen to us....?".  I'll admit that I'm a fan and sometimes fans can have higher expectations than they should.  I'll also admit that the Gomez thing was a punch in the balls.  I'll also admit that Sunday was better than Saturday.  And I'll also admit that it's hard not to be super excited about Hamiti - he looks so darn good and I'm guessing most people LOVE his attitude and style.  That being said, it would be so awesome in 2 weeks to see Hamiti make a strong run at a title and bring 3-4-5 guys along with him to the podium and maybe 2-3 of them beating a few higher seeds ("signature wins") along the way and a top 10 team finish. 

Interesting that you mentioned Minnesota and they did have 2 6 seeds make the finals which is amazing. However they did not have a Big 10 champ, they qualified the same # as the Badgers (7) and Blockhus making the final is certainly partially result of Gomez being hurt. The results are really not significantly different than the Badgers as far as wrestling to seed and the Gomez injuries certainly impacted that.

Here is how they wrestled vs seed
Wrestler-seed-place
Mckee-5-6
Nagao-6-2
Bergeland-5-8
Blockhus-6-2
Lee-11-DNP (did not earn an allocation and not sure if he will get a wild card)
Sparks-9-9
O'Reilly-4-4
Salazar-3-4
Foy-9-8
Joles-11-10

[Handles II]

Add to it that MN couldn't get Patrick Kennedy to stay at home. In fact not one of the D1 guys from his high school (Kasson/Mantorville) in recent history have gone to the gophers.
Sam Stoll, Brock Berge, and Kennedy all went to Iowa. Their head coach wrestled at Iowa, that's where his allegiance is and he's a known hater of the gophers(granted Brady Berge went to Penn St) 
Sounds a little familiar.

[vsmf2010]

Add to it that MN couldn't get Patrick Kennedy to stay at home. In fact not one of the D1 guys from his high school (Kasson/Mantorville) in recent history have gone to the gophers.
Sam Stoll, Brock Berge, and Kennedy all went to Iowa. Their head coach wrestled at Iowa, that's where his allegiance is and he's a known hater of the gophers(granted Brady Berge went to Penn St) 
Sounds a little familiar.

I did not know that and thanks for sharing. That has got to sting for MN fans. They have a pretty strong distain for all things Iowa. 

[BadgerOne]

I get the point vsmf, and it's hard to argue with you.  However, watching on Saturday was very discouraging to me.
 Seeing a number of Minnesota guys overperform and win close matches made me ask myself "why doesn't that ever happen to us....?".  I'll admit that I'm a fan and sometimes fans can have higher expectations than they should.  I'll also admit that the Gomez thing was a punch in the balls.  I'll also admit that Sunday was better than Saturday.  And I'll also admit that it's hard not to be super excited about Hamiti - he looks so darn good and I'm guessing most people LOVE his attitude and style.  That being said, it would be so awesome in 2 weeks to see Hamiti make a strong run at a title and bring 3-4-5 guys along with him to the podium and maybe 2-3 of them beating a few higher seeds ("signature wins") along the way and a top 10 team finish. 

Interesting that you mentioned Minnesota and they did have 2 6 seeds make the finals which is amazing. However they did not have a Big 10 champ, they qualified the same # as the Badgers (7) and Blockhus making the final is certainly partially result of Gomez being hurt. The results are really not significantly different than the Badgers as far as wrestling to seed and the Gomez injuries certainly impacted that.

Here is how they wrestled vs seed
Wrestler-seed-place
Mckee-5-6
Nagao-6-2
Bergeland-5-8
Blockhus-6-2
Lee-11-DNP (did not earn an allocation and not sure if he will get a wild card)
Sparks-9-9
O'Reilly-8-8
Salazar-3-4
Foy-9-8
Joles-11-10

But Minnesota outplaced Wisconsin and while you bring up effect of Gomez injury, the Gophers didn't have benefit of Gable Stevenson who had a year of eligibility left and clearly Brayton Lee is wrestling hurt this year.  I don't think Wisconsin's program is yet on par with the Gophers, though maybe next year the Badgers close the gap, but thenafter Bono will have to recruit better to keep up with or surpass the Gophers.

[vsmf2010]

I get the point vsmf, and it's hard to argue with you.  However, watching on Saturday was very discouraging to me.
 Seeing a number of Minnesota guys overperform and win close matches made me ask myself "why doesn't that ever happen to us....?".  I'll admit that I'm a fan and sometimes fans can have higher expectations than they should.  I'll also admit that the Gomez thing was a punch in the balls.  I'll also admit that Sunday was better than Saturday.  And I'll also admit that it's hard not to be super excited about Hamiti - he looks so darn good and I'm guessing most people LOVE his attitude and style.  That being said, it would be so awesome in 2 weeks to see Hamiti make a strong run at a title and bring 3-4-5 guys along with him to the podium and maybe 2-3 of them beating a few higher seeds ("signature wins") along the way and a top 10 team finish. 

Interesting that you mentioned Minnesota and they did have 2 6 seeds make the finals which is amazing. However they did not have a Big 10 champ, they qualified the same # as the Badgers (7) and Blockhus making the final is certainly partially result of Gomez being hurt. The results are really not significantly different than the Badgers as far as wrestling to seed and the Gomez injuries certainly impacted that.

Here is how they wrestled vs seed
Wrestler-seed-place
Mckee-5-6
Nagao-6-2
Bergeland-5-8
Blockhus-6-2
Lee-11-DNP (did not earn an allocation and not sure if he will get a wild card)
Sparks-9-9
O'Reilly-8-8
Salazar-3-4
Foy-9-8
Joles-11-10

But Minnesota outplaced Wisconsin and while you bring up effect of Gomez injury, the Gophers didn't have benefit of Gable Stevenson who had a year of eligibility left and clearly Brayton Lee is wrestling hurt this year.  I don't think Wisconsin's program is yet on par with the Gophers, though maybe next year the Badgers close the gap, but thenafter Bono will have to recruit better to keep up with or surpass the Gophers.

Clearly Gable is the ultimate trump card. Not having the Olympic champ and slam dunk NCAA champ with a year of eligibly left is going to suck for sure.

Lee to Gomez is not much of a comparison. Lee has not been there really all year. He is 4-9 and was the 11 seed so there was not an expectation of him doing very well at the Big Tens or the NCAA's. Gomez was a 2 seed and the only person ever to beat a 3 timer.

The Gophers outplaced the Badgers at the Big Tens but unless you are in the hunt for the title I don't know that the coaches care. The goal is to get as many healthy bodies into the NCAA tournament as possible. As far the tournament it certainly is possible the Badgers out point the Gophers even without any points from Gomez.

My point was just responding to Paul who was discouraged by the Badgers and encouraged by how the Gophers wrestled and I was just showing with data that there really was not much difference. My question to you BadgerOne, is would you rather have the Gophers Big Ten Results or the Badgers and would you rather have the the Gopher qualifiers or the Badger Qualifiers going into the NCAA tournament?

[Wis-Mallard]

Bailey O'Reilly was 4th seed and placed 4th for MN.

Gomez being out or hurt tips the scales towards Gophers IMO. Will be interesting to see how teams are seeded. Looking at mat scouts summary from last year you basically have to be top 12 seed to AA except for 4 exceptions. Hamiti looks like best bet for either team to AA.

[asdf]

I'd rather have Minn season dual record (12-3 vs. 8-8), Big Ten record (5-3 verus 1-7), Big Ten placing (6 vs., Cross border recruiting (7 WI kids on Minn. roster, vs. UW having ONE MN kid), Roster size (33 vs 27), Open tourney results (look them up), their RTC, and head to head victory this year.

Even if (big if) UW outscores Minn in a couple weeks, they literally are better then UW in every metric.  It sucks, but it is a fact.

And as for all this "but injuries"-PSU has Robbie Howard, Nebraska got 3rd and absolutely stomped UW with arguably their best wrestler red shirting the whole year (Ridge Lovett), Minn has Gable S, and I bet almost every team can say the same. 

[bigoil]

I'd rather have Minn season dual record (12-3 vs. 8-8), Big Ten record (5-3 verus 1-7), Big Ten placing (6 vs., Cross border recruiting (7 WI kids on Minn. roster, vs. UW having ONE MN kid), Roster size (33 vs 27), Open tourney results (look them up), their RTC, and head to head victory this year.

Even if (big if) UW outscores Minn in a couple weeks, they literally are better then UW in every metric.  It sucks, but it is a fact.

And as for all this "but injuries"-PSU has Robbie Howard, Nebraska got 3rd and absolutely stomped UW with arguably their best wrestler red shirting the whole year (Ridge Lovett), Minn has Gable S, and I bet almost every team can say the same. 

MN had 12 guys qualify for the NCAA's, 9 of them wrestle outside of MN. WI had 5 kids qualify, 3 are from outside WI.

[vsmf2010]

Bailey O'Reilly was 4th seed and placed 4th for MN.

Gomez being out or hurt tips the scales towards Gophers IMO. Will be interesting to see how teams are seeded. Looking at mat scouts summary from last year you basically have to be top 12 seed to AA except for 4 exceptions. Hamiti looks like best bet for either team to AA.

Typo on O'Reilly sorry.

Top 12 seeds should be

Barnett
Gomez
Hamiti
Hilger

McKee
Nagao
Blockhus (possibly)
O'Reilly
Salazar

[wrastle63]

I'd rather have Minn season dual record (12-3 vs. 8-8), Big Ten record (5-3 verus 1-7), Big Ten placing (6 vs., Cross border recruiting (7 WI kids on Minn. roster, vs. UW having ONE MN kid), Roster size (33 vs 27), Open tourney results (look them up), their RTC, and head to head victory this year.

Even if (big if) UW outscores Minn in a couple weeks, they literally are better then UW in every metric.  It sucks, but it is a fact.

And as for all this "but injuries"-PSU has Robbie Howard, Nebraska got 3rd and absolutely stomped UW with arguably their best wrestler red shirting the whole year (Ridge Lovett), Minn has Gable S, and I bet almost every team can say the same. 

Minnesota does not have Gable. He is not enrolled and moved on. Not even remotely the same as Lovett, Howard, or Gomez being hurt. NCAAs is what people will measure the season by not how many kids are on their roster, or how kid did at open tournaments, or a dual in January. Minnesota fans were talking about getting 0 AAs(which they still might) and firing their coach before Big Tens. Maybe ask them what they would rather have