Badgers vs. IU

[Brett Favre - R.I.P.]

UW dominates worst team in the BIG TEN

[bigG]

I thought Barry should have been fired back in 2000 when it was very apparent that Iowa and Minnesota were vastly superior to the teams Barry was putting on the mat.
But, here we are, 18 years later and we did beat Indiana, but you have to admit it was not the kind of win that makes you think the Badgers are going to finish in the top half of the Big Ten Conference Tournament yet again.  I think 9th place is where this team finishes.  Next up is a very young Nebraska team and hopefully the team is ready to wrestle a little better.  The Wick boy certainly can wrestle, that much we can agree on.  And I also finally must agree with the, "wait until next year" comment that has become popular since I agree that it is true.  This team a year from now will not be significantly better or worse and we will once again be fighting for 8 or 9th place in the conference.   We have an expanded database of results to look at and come back next year and you will find that Ben's comment rings true, like it or not.

It's true that watching the Badgers year after year has been like trying to get enthusiastic over tapioca. Maybe Ben would do worse; though I doubt it. Better or worse, Ben would try something new. Knowing him, he'd find a way to win. I'd rather risk Bucky getting worse than to stay on this same hamster wheel. It's just been too long.

[npope]

It's true that watching the Badgers year after year has been like trying to get enthusiastic over tapioca. Maybe Ben would do worse; though I doubt it. Better or worse, Ben would try something new. Knowing him, he'd find a way to win. I'd rather risk Bucky getting worse than to stay on this same hamster wheel. It's just been too long.

I used to think that way about our political system here in the US...I'm not so sure anymore - I've tempered my demands for anarchy 

[wrastle63]

You don't think any of this year's freshmen will fill in and this years guys will improve?
25 Rotando or Konrath
33 Konrath or Lantz
41 ES
49 CM
59 ZW
65 EW
74 Covaciu
84 RC
97 HR good send with Mason
H  Hillger

I don't see that line-up lighting the world on fire but they should be some good potential to have 8-9 make the NCAA and a shot at 1-2 AA but lets focus on this year before jumping to next.

Think our best lineup would be Christensen at 74, Ritter back to 84, and Reinhardt at 97. Feel like we will be improved from what we have this year but not much will be like 7th or 8th in Big Ten.

[BuckyMatt]

UW dominates worst team in the BIG TEN

The result against Indiana was FAR from domination!

[bigG]

It's true that watching the Badgers year after year has been like trying to get enthusiastic over tapioca. Maybe Ben would do worse; though I doubt it. Better or worse, Ben would try something new. Knowing him, he'd find a way to win. I'd rather risk Bucky getting worse than to stay on this same hamster wheel. It's just been too long.

I used to think that way about our political system here in the US...I'm not so sure anymore - I've tempered my demands for anarchy 

LOL! Now THAT was funny.

When we "landed" BD, I was so jacked because we'd be in the Gable family; and, of course, at the time, Gable was on his way out (at least as the full-time coach). BD was a fantastic wrestler and had the Gable grit. He's done mediocre, IMHO. Some great, but also a lot of just mediocre. He's had a nice long stretch. Just think it's time he fancy the idea of a replacement. I like Ben; but BD might be best served enjoying a healthy and happy retirement. I'm also a huge Brandvold fan; bu think a change in the philosophy would be warranted.

[FoldEmUp]

Here's the reality.  Wrestling is 10th or lower on the list of sports Barry Alvarez cares about.  first come the revenue sports 1.  Football  2. Men's Basketball 3. Men's Hockey  4. Women's Volleyball (starting to be) and 5. Women's Basketball (potential to be).  Those will always come before wrestling.  They have the potential to at least pay their own way...and FB and to a lesser extent Men's Basketball fund the entire athletic department.

Then comes non-revenue sports we're good at such as track, cross country, etc.  Then down the list is wrestling.  This isn't Iowa with a rich wrestling history, or Pennsylvania where they live and breathe wrestling.  This is Wisconsin.  I really appreciate Ben's BHAG of making the state of Wisconsin a wrestling force, but for now we're nowhere near that and he'd be the first to acknowledge that.  I don't see kids in high schools across the state wearing Wisconsin Wrestling gear.  I see Ohio State and Iowa but not Wisconsin.  It is similar to what Alvarez said he encountered when he took over the Badger football program that he and his recruiters saw kids wearing Michigan and Michigan State gear.

When it comes to a sport like wrestling, Alvarez wants a good clean program that isn't going to give him headaches.  The program, despite the higher expectations from a number of us (which I agree we should have), while not the greatest in the conference has performed respectably nationally.  We're no world beaters, but from Alvarez's perch he doesn't have to worry about drama and we're a decent program, although many of know it leaves a lot to be desired.  We have our flash in the pan years where we finish respectably high at the NCAA's, but as long as we're not a horrendous team that can't even compete in the BIG or at the national level why should he busy himself with a coaching search in a non-revenue program.

We may not like it, but it's the reality of the situation.

[littleguy301]

If I couldnt do better than this you wouldnt have to ask me to leave I would find the door myself.

make sure it isnt a revolving door, those will get me from time to time

[dman]

If we as a wrestling community in WI continue to make excuses as to why we can't be a power house we never will be.  I for one think we can become one of the best states for wrestling but if everyone doesn't have that attitude it will never happen.  All the great teams in collage would never have the idea that they couldn't be great enter their mind...ever...even when they were not at the top.

As for Alverez, I think of it differently...I do think he cares...I believe he cares about all the sports at WI and their success.  However, there is a lot to be said about friendships...and long term friendships at that.

[bigG]

I think he cares, too. But I would suspect he cares more about having a clean, no-headaches , program.  It's no mystery why the top dogs are where they are. Great wrestling states produce great wrestlers, then hand pick the studs from other states. Fans of WIAA folkstyle don't see how we compare to other states. Most don't care. So, we're left with the clubs and dedicated parents to try to up their kids and, in the process, up our state's stud count. Honestly, we need the few studs we have. We got nothing on our neighbors: MN, IL, IA. I like Ben's moxy and the way he's done things (save for 'I mean business" ) and his vision for our state's wrestling. Maybe we could be unique, like him. But, as a state, we're donw refs and wrestlers while states down south move up in numbers. We are currently a basketball state. Gonna have to move to MN , IL or IA if that upsets you. Heck, the badgers can't even hoop this year.

[FoldEmUp]

If we as a wrestling community in WI continue to make excuses as to why we can't be a power house we never will be.  I for one think we can become one of the best states for wrestling but if everyone doesn't have that attitude it will never happen.  All the great teams in collage would never have the idea that they couldn't be great enter their mind...ever...even when they were not at the top.

As for Alverez, I think of it differently...I do think he cares...I believe he cares about all the sports at WI and their success.  However, there is a lot to be said about friendships...and long term friendships at that.

'

I didn't say Alvarez doesn't care.  I said wrestling is down his list of priorities being a non-revenue sport, and not our most successful non-revenue sports.  I'm sure personal friendships do matter...as do all the things I mentioned earlier.  Friendship or not, if Barry Davis brought with him any conflict or issues at all he wouldn't be around today based upon the lackluster results on the mat.  Not something Barry wants to deal with in his non-revenue sports.  But Barry Davis is a good guy, doesn't bring drama with him, runs a clean program, and they compete...although not at a level we want.

I know our high school head coach shares Ben Askren's BHAG (big hairy audacious goal) of making the state of Wisconsin a wrestling powerhouse.  We talk about it all the time.  We're currently working on our own BHAGs as a program, but we have to be honest that the state of Wisconsin isn't anywhere near the point of being a national wrestling powerhouse at the present time.  Ten years from now we might be singing a different tune and I hope we are!

[Barou]

If we as a wrestling community in WI continue to make excuses as to why we can't be a power house we never will be.  I for one think we can become one of the best states for wrestling but if everyone doesn't have that attitude it will never happen.  All the great teams in collage would never have the idea that they couldn't be great enter their mind...ever...even when they were not at the top.

As for Alverez, I think of it differently...I do think he cares...I believe he cares about all the sports at WI and their success.  However, there is a lot to be said about friendships...and long term friendships at that.

'

I didn't say Alvarez doesn't care.  I said wrestling is down his list of priorities being a non-revenue sport, and not our most successful non-revenue sports.  I'm sure personal friendships do matter...as do all the things I mentioned earlier.  Friendship or not, if Barry Davis brought with him any conflict or issues at all he wouldn't be around today based upon the lackluster results on the mat.  Not something Barry wants to deal with in his non-revenue sports.  But Barry Davis is a good guy, doesn't bring drama with him, runs a clean program, and they compete...although not at a level we want.

I know our high school head coach shares Ben Askren's BHAG (big hairy audacious goal) of making the state of Wisconsin a wrestling powerhouse.  We talk about it all the time.  We're currently working on our own BHAGs as a program, but we have to be honest that the state of Wisconsin isn't anywhere near the point of being a national wrestling powerhouse at the present time.  Ten years from now we might be singing a different tune and I hope we are!

I'll say it, I don't think Alvarez cares at all.  If he cared, a change would have been made a long time ago.  He's seen an empty Fieldhouse for duals all the time since he's been at UW.  I turn on the BTN and watch an OSU/Iowa dual that has 15,000+ fans and Urban Meyer sitting matside!.  OK, so the supporters will talk about all the great advantages that OSU has and that we can't possibly think UW could ever measure up to those great programs, fine.  How about Rutgers then?  Watched their dual against PSU and that place was full and rockin!  Are expectations too high to want to be like Rutgers, SD State, etc?

[bkraus]

Its sad that I got a better write up and detailed box score off the Indiana site than the winning team.  And I looked this morning.  The SID had 4 days to post anything on the dual, and what they did was garbage.

[bigG]

If we as a wrestling community in WI continue to make excuses as to why we can't be a power house we never will be.  I for one think we can become one of the best states for wrestling but if everyone doesn't have that attitude it will never happen.  All the great teams in collage would never have the idea that they couldn't be great enter their mind...ever...even when they were not at the top.

As for Alverez, I think of it differently...I do think he cares...I believe he cares about all the sports at WI and their success.  However, there is a lot to be said about friendships...and long term friendships at that.

'

I didn't say Alvarez doesn't care.  I said wrestling is down his list of priorities being a non-revenue sport, and not our most successful non-revenue sports.  I'm sure personal friendships do matter...as do all the things I mentioned earlier.  Friendship or not, if Barry Davis brought with him any conflict or issues at all he wouldn't be around today based upon the lackluster results on the mat.  Not something Barry wants to deal with in his non-revenue sports.  But Barry Davis is a good guy, doesn't bring drama with him, runs a clean program, and they compete...although not at a level we want.

I know our high school head coach shares Ben Askren's BHAG (big hairy audacious goal) of making the state of Wisconsin a wrestling powerhouse.  We talk about it all the time.  We're currently working on our own BHAGs as a program, but we have to be honest that the state of Wisconsin isn't anywhere near the point of being a national wrestling powerhouse at the present time.  Ten years from now we might be singing a different tune and I hope we are!

I'll say it, I don't think Alvarez cares at all.  If he cared, a change would have been made a long time ago.  He's seen an empty Fieldhouse for duals all the time since he's been at UW.  I turn on the BTN and watch an OSU/Iowa dual that has 15,000+ fans and Urban Meyer sitting matsid!.  OK, so the supporters will talk about all the great advantages that OSU has and that we can't possibly think UW could ever measure up to those great programs, fine.  How about Rutgers then?  Watched their dual against PSU and that place was full and rockin!  Are expectations too high to want to be like Rutgers, SD State, etc?

I don't think he cares about how competitive the team is compared to the big boys. I think he cares about a low-maintenance program. The sad thing is, we're going the way of Indiana with lower HS numbers of wrestlers in an already numbers poor state. I honestly don't think we'd get 15,000 if we were a top 3 team. I really don't. You and I would show up, Barou, along with the wrestling faithful of badgerland. 5,000 would be impressive for us.

But, the reason I like Ben is that I believe he'd be both the great coach AND the great promoter. He's just different. A little nuts, but nuts like a fox. Okay, maybe that didn't translate the way I wanted it.

I doubt Alvarez sees things as we do. Can't blame him. Rather be secure than to go for it. Still, I would hope that WI would go for the gold, no matter the sport.

[Barou]

If we as a wrestling community in WI continue to make excuses as to why we can't be a power house we never will be.  I for one think we can become one of the best states for wrestling but if everyone doesn't have that attitude it will never happen.  All the great teams in collage would never have the idea that they couldn't be great enter their mind...ever...even when they were not at the top.

As for Alverez, I think of it differently...I do think he cares...I believe he cares about all the sports at WI and their success.  However, there is a lot to be said about friendships...and long term friendships at that.

'

I didn't say Alvarez doesn't care.  I said wrestling is down his list of priorities being a non-revenue sport, and not our most successful non-revenue sports.  I'm sure personal friendships do matter...as do all the things I mentioned earlier.  Friendship or not, if Barry Davis brought with him any conflict or issues at all he wouldn't be around today based upon the lackluster results on the mat.  Not something Barry wants to deal with in his non-revenue sports.  But Barry Davis is a good guy, doesn't bring drama with him, runs a clean program, and they compete...although not at a level we want.

I know our high school head coach shares Ben Askren's BHAG (big hairy audacious goal) of making the state of Wisconsin a wrestling powerhouse.  We talk about it all the time.  We're currently working on our own BHAGs as a program, but we have to be honest that the state of Wisconsin isn't anywhere near the point of being a national wrestling powerhouse at the present time.  Ten years from now we might be singing a different tune and I hope we are!

I'll say it, I don't think Alvarez cares at all.  If he cared, a change would have been made a long time ago.  He's seen an empty Fieldhouse for duals all the time since he's been at UW.  I turn on the BTN and watch an OSU/Iowa dual that has 15,000+ fans and Urban Meyer sitting matsid!.  OK, so the supporters will talk about all the great advantages that OSU has and that we can't possibly think UW could ever measure up to those great programs, fine.  How about Rutgers then?  Watched their dual against PSU and that place was full and rockin!  Are expectations too high to want to be like Rutgers, SD State, etc?

I don't think he cares about how competitive the team is compared to the big boys. I think he cares about a low-maintenance program. The sad thing is, we're going the way of Indiana with lower HS numbers of wrestlers in an already numbers poor state. I honestly don't think we'd get 15,000 if we were a top 3 team. I really don't. You and I would show up, Barou, along with the wrestling faithful of badgerland. 5,000 would be impressive for us.

But, the reason I like Ben is that I believe he'd be both the great coach AND the great promoter. He's just different. A little nuts, but nuts like a fox. Okay, maybe that didn't translate the way I wanted it.

I doubt Alvarez sees things as we do. Can't blame him. Rather be secure than to go for it. Still, I would hope that WI would go for the gold, no matter the sport.

It would be a great day if demand was high enough to move a dual to the Kohl Center.