Why???

[lizard king]

VSMf2010 and others,  Not all of us that are sometimes negative are bashing the kids in any way, in fact just the opposite. I completely agree with everything you say about a kid doing 4-5 years in college and playing any sport is incredible.  In fact, a very high percentage do not have the ability, and a very high percentage of them can not make it all 4-5 years.  Then, if you put the rigor of a tough major on top of that, at any school, wow!  great job.  My only point of negative is this; If a kid is going to work that hard, sacrifice that much, the least we can do is give him his best shot at reaching his dreams.  For most of these kids, being a national qualifier, an All American, and/or a national champ, is the dream.  20 years ago I thought we were doing that, but after a long review, I am not sure if the WI kids are developing as well as they could?  Maybe it is time to give a different coach a chance to help these kids who we all support?

[stp]

It wasnt long ago that there was a thread on the Ohio State forum about is tom ryan really the man for the job. Due to it seemed he was getting talent like a mad man but they just were not panning out.

That was around the time of Jamison and Colin Palmer and I believe injuries derailed them not Ryan.

imo- Jamison was never a top tier collegiate wrestler and Colin Palmer decided he was not, either. 

[npope]

VSMf2010 and others,  Not all of us that are sometimes negative are bashing the kids in any way, in fact just the opposite. I completely agree with everything you say about a kid doing 4-5 years in college and playing any sport is incredible.  In fact, a very high percentage do not have the ability, and a very high percentage of them can not make it all 4-5 years.  Then, if you put the rigor of a tough major on top of that, at any school, wow!  great job.  My only point of negative is this; If a kid is going to work that hard, sacrifice that much, the least we can do is give him his best shot at reaching his dreams.  For most of these kids, being a national qualifier, an All American, and/or a national champ, is the dream.  20 years ago I thought we were doing that, but after a long review, I am not sure if the WI kids are developing as well as they could?  Maybe it is time to give a different coach a chance to help these kids who we all support?

You are right in that stating something negative or noting something less than ideal about the program or coach isn't necessarily a significant offense in the eyes of many (although there are always some who will take exception). But often times there comes a point on a given thread where the negativity is simply oppressive - and that is unnecessary and counter-productive, IMO. Point made - move on. I do think that,even though this forum is just a little corner of Badger wrestling fandom, it does have some over-sized visibility for readers - that likely include kids on the team, prospective recruits and their families, etc. So, excessive negativity in this setting does serve to negatively influence the team. I don't think negatively bashing the coaching staff and the team's (lack of) success serves any positive end - other than just letting fans vent. So, I would suggest venting and then letting it go, or possibly moving the discussion to one of principles, e.g., what is the true role of sports (wrestling) in college. Making it less personal might actually get at some sort of conversation that has some intellectual value.

All that said, I almost never think it's okay to call out a specific young athlete on the forum. Call them young men, boys, whatever. The fact that they openly compete in school sponsored athletics does not make them fodder and grist for fans who think they have a right to say whatever they want on a public forum - sometimes it is simply not cool.

And yes, lizard, there are any number of folks who aren't fans of BD who are considerate in their written posts. I don't mean to suggest that there is no place for some negativity on the forum - it is a great place to hear opinions and share thoughts. That said, one has to incessantly post stuff at either extreme - and most don't.

[dman]

Who get's to determine what is excessive negativity and isn't...you npope?

[npope]

Who get's to determine what is excessive negativity and isn't...you npope?

You seem to be taking a negative tone at this point...consider yourself flagged.

[Barou]

Acceptance is the key. That's what I took from 73's post.

Almost sounds like a Union Hall around here, where mediocrity is accepted. 

There are folks on this forum who do defend mediocrity, passionately in fact. I'm not sure what that has to do with organized labor though.

To be fair, they don't necessarily defend mediocrity. They try to bring some balance to the conversation when the thread goes wild for BD's head. They do accept the situation more readily than the detractors, and of that I am guilty.

They are blind loyalists who attempt to "chastise" real fans for their expectations. Claiming those who are critical of the direction of the program, are bashing kids... Yet, when Howe,Rutt,JT, or St.Donny defect, it's open season for these fools to take their cheap shots.

Perfectly said.  And we shouldn't talk about why they left.  Nobody is allowed to know "why" only that BD was in the right and it's in the past. 

[Ivan Stankowski]

Acceptance is the key. That's what I took from 73's post.

Almost sounds like a Union Hall around here, where mediocrity is accepted. 

There are folks on this forum who do defend mediocrity, passionately in fact. I'm not sure what that has to do with organized labor though.

To be fair, they don't necessarily defend mediocrity. They try to bring some balance to the conversation when the thread goes wild for BD's head. They do accept the situation more readily than the detractors, and of that I am guilty.

They are blind loyalists who attempt to "chastise" real fans for their expectations. Claiming those who are critical of the direction of the program, are bashing kids... Yet, when Howe,Rutt,JT, or St.Donny defect, it's open season for these fools to take their cheap shots.

Perfectly said.  And we shouldn't talk about why they left.  Nobody is allowed to know "why" only that BD was in the right and it's in the past. 

Is this Sarcasm We need a dang sarcasm button so I am not so confused

[Grappler]

i feel like ive seen like 6 posts this year already that look exactly like this..you guys have  talking in circles about the badgers shortcomings down pat

[npope]

i feel like ive seen like 6 posts this year already that look exactly like this..you guys have  talking in circles about the badgers shortcomings down pat

Yeah. No one is more sick of reading my negative posts than I am. It's the "pom-pom" waiving posters and their excuses that get me going.

I don't know - we could take a poll to find out the actual answer to that one 

[cross-face]

Acceptance is the key. That's what I took from 73's post.

Almost sounds like a Union Hall around here, where mediocrity is accepted. 

There are folks on this forum who do defend mediocrity, passionately in fact. I'm not sure what that has to do with organized labor though.

To be fair, they don't necessarily defend mediocrity. They try to bring some balance to the conversation when the thread goes wild for BD's head. They do accept the situation more readily than the detractors, and of that I am guilty.

They are blind loyalists who attempt to "chastise" real fans for their expectations. Claiming those who are critical of the direction of the program, are bashing kids... Yet, when Howe,Rutt,JT, or St.Donny defect, it's open season for these fools to take their cheap shots.

Angry - aren't you the one who didn't want to be lectured on how to be a fan? Like you, I don't recall direct individual bashing of the wrestlers. We fools just see a different side of the coin than you.