Support for JH inclusion?

ramjet · January 22, 2014, 01:04:48 PM

Thats was exactly my point Aaron I also think you can forget the grade thing and make it an age thing regardless of the grade they are in. Heck WWF uses age criteria and it works very well all they way through the Junior Division.

briggs · January 22, 2014, 01:20:23 PM

Bottom line is there are 100s if not 1000s of examples where a 7th or 8th grade wrestler is better than the varsity wrestler on their hometown team. WI needs to wake up and change the rule, even if it is on a trial basis.

Handles II · January 22, 2014, 02:50:04 PM

Athletic directors won't bring it up seriously in their meetings. Most know nothing and care nothing about wrestling, and therefore the WIAA and Dave Anderson in particular would never see it come to them, nor approve it if it did.
There are also too many WI coaches that are against it because they don't understand it. I've got two assistants from WI who now completely understand and see the advantages of JHI after only 2 months in the room.

chuckref · January 22, 2014, 03:07:15 PM

Keep in mind that JHI is not just for wrestling, but would have to be for ALL sports, just like the JV State Tourney. It can work but I think most AD's are against it for that reason more than anything.

Chuck

MantyWrestler · January 22, 2014, 03:12:43 PM

Quote from: chuckref on January 22, 2014, 03:07:15 PM
Keep in mind that JHI is not just for wrestling, but would have to be for ALL sports, just like the JV State Tourney. It can work but I think most AD's are against it for that reason more than anything.

Chuck

What do you mean by that? I don't think it does. We never used to have a separate team tournament but now we do. I think it could change back. Besides, we wouldn't have to name it a JV State Championship either. Could be regional.

Also, if a kid can compete on a varsity level he should be allowed to. It works in MN and many other states but of course it would never work here otherwise kids would get hurt or quit. Please

chuckref · January 22, 2014, 03:31:29 PM

I am pretty sure that Junior High Inclusion would have to be for all sports. Why would they just do it for Wrestling? I want to see JHI as much as the next guy. I'm just telling you why it probably won't happen here.

Chuck

MNbadger · January 22, 2014, 03:35:22 PM

It is done for all sports in MN.
Several years back one of the teams in the state tournament for hockey was an 8th grader.
There are basketball players (actually more in boys than girls curiously enough), track, wrestling, and many others.

ThirdTimeACharm · January 22, 2014, 04:10:36 PM

I would suggest that WI as a state... without JHI (regardless or sport or academics) is hitting their head on the cave on the way home. My 8th grader, who also wrestles, is currently taking Advanced Placement 11th grade core Algebra II... and OBTW, the HS isn't even sure it counts towards his 3 years of math graduation requirement $:-\$ (even though his brother, who is a JR, is taking the same class and it does count towards that requirement). Either way, it is apparently his academic ability or advanced performance that resulted in his placement in this class. So... should he not be in this class because of his age? Should he not be in this class because his conventional peers could not keep up? It's apparent his capability in this particular area was higher than that of his peers. He also could wrestle with all our 9th and 10th grade wrestlers just fine and likely compete for a varsity spot... but he isn't. My point... if it works in the classroom (which is most important), why can't it work on the mat, the court, the field, or any other venue... either academic or sports oriented that our kids are involved in??

bigoil · January 22, 2014, 04:22:26 PM

Quote from: ThirdTimeACharm on January 22, 2014, 04:10:36 PM
I would suggest that WI as a state... without JHI (regardless or sport or academics) is hitting their head on the cave on the way home. My 8th grader, who also wrestles, is currently taking Advanced Placement 11th grade core Algebra II... and OBTW, the HS isn't even sure it counts towards his 3 years of math graduation requirement $:-\$ (even though his brother, who is a JR, is taking the same class and it does count towards that requirement). Either way, it is apparently his academic ability or advanced performance that resulted in his placement in this class. So... should he not be in this class because of his age? Should he not be in this class because his conventional peers could not keep up? It's apparent his capability in this particular area was higher than that of his peers. He also could wrestle with all our 9th and 10th grade wrestlers just fine and likely compete for a varsity spot... but he isn't. My point... if it works in the classroom (which is most important), why can't it work on the mat, the court, the field, or any other venue... either academic or sports oriented that our kids are involved in??

I hear you on this, makes sense. Now for an extreme example, let's say the school offers a spanish class but will only do so if 14 kids sign up. 13 kids are all set to go but can't do it so they recruit a 7th grader to come on board.

Aaron, 7th graders are 12 yo to start the year unless held back, by normal curve, most would be 12 through the end of February.

littleguy301 · January 22, 2014, 06:56:31 PM

JHI would have to be for all sports otherwise it just wouldnt fly! To much PC.

Every year at state time in other sports from wrestling you hear about an out of hand 8th grader in track, b-ball, hockey for both boys and girls. I think this past year one of the teams had a 8th grade lineman competing in the state championship. Big Boy though it could have been 2012 also.

If JHI is so good, they why is only 3 states doing it. I would figure Texas with football would be chomping at the bit to get some very good 8th graders in the starting lineup. I cannt remember where Calvin Johnson is from but wasnt he something like 6 foot and 180 pounds as an 8th grader? I would think a guy that size would start for most High School programs, I also figured he was an athlete back in his youth, dont think a guy like that just devolped out of no where. Do I have the right guy in Calvin Johnson or was it AJ Green or another.

boowrestle · January 22, 2014, 09:11:29 PM

Littleguy there are more than 3 states that have JHI,

imnofish · January 22, 2014, 11:09:38 PM

Quote from: briggs on January 22, 2014, 01:20:23 PM
Bottom line is there are 100s if not 1000s of examples where a 7th or 8th grade wrestler is better than the varsity wrestler on their hometown team. WI needs to wake up and change the rule, even if it is on a trial basis.

Yep. My son could beat our varsity kid at his weight when he was in 6th grade. He wanted Wisconsin to make the change back then, so he could have that opportunity. I think this change could really benefit the small schools, especially if it allowed more of the middle school kids to participate in the high school practices.

littleguy301 · January 22, 2014, 11:17:31 PM

Quote from: boowrestle on January 22, 2014, 09:11:29 PM
Littleguy there are more than 3 states that have JHI,

Cool, how many do then. I am sorry that I stated 3 but for some reasons that number rings in my head along with other things.

3 in the midwest?

Houndhead · January 22, 2014, 11:58:07 PM

Does MN have JH inclusion for all sports?

imnofish · January 23, 2014, 12:02:20 AM

Quote from: MNbadger on January 22, 2014, 03:35:22 PM
It is done for all sports in MN.
Several years back one of the teams in the state tournament for hockey was an 8th grader.
There are basketball players (actually more in boys than girls curiously enough), track, wrestling, and many others.

My daughter would have loved competing in high school track as an 8th grader! It would have been good for her, too, IMO.