Re: heroin

[Houndhead]

The real question is why did Badger lie about someone saying private is better than public, and then run away and hide when asked to back it up.

[bigG]

Many people do choose private over public; why would they go that way if they didn't think there were advantages to private?

I'm fine with their right to choose. It's the public money used to cover that cost I'd have issue with; but that's no mystery.

I can remember three teachers in my public school career that were subpar. In this day and age, they wouldn't have lasted a week.
Still, I can respect why people choose to have religion or a specific focus involved in their schooling. Many public schools contain voucher schools that allow for different formats and focus. I'm good with that. If it helps kids achieve, go git 'em. Again, in terms of religion, I think those churches and religious institutions should be fully taxed in order to get the public $$. Not trying to insult you, Mark, but you know what I'm saying.

CCD is another thing. man, those were some messed up "teachers" I had. Had one nun that just flat out punched kids.

[MarkK]

If the argument is someone needs to be fully taxed to get public money.  Well then you might as well disqualify everyone who gets public money.   I take no offence to your statement g I don't want "public" money.  I do want parents to have a choice.   They can pick what is important to them.   How many public schools pay property taxes or corporate taxes?   I could show you churches that pay more state propery taxes than public schools.   I get that education is a public service.  Even private institutions are providing a public service.   They are not running the public schools out of business.  They just don't subscribe to the big box view of education.  

[dman]

Agreed mark!

[Handles II]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

[bigoil]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

Can you please show me this law?

[maggie]

law?, did anyone here see the word law in handles post?...howavi, are you seeing things? or just fibbing...

[MarkK]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

How about a separate line that shows all the outsourcing that takes place .  How about a line going about the money given to private corporations through the public schools.   This is a bogus argument not even based on facts.  All of those books are open to the public.  Anyone can see what is going where.  It is not under the table.  Everyday that the bus goes by and drop off the kids at a private school they do it in middle of the day for all the public to see.  Nothing is under the table. 

BTW, that is public transportation for school age kids.   On top of that why am I paying for my neighbor to send his kids on the bus when he makes way more money than me and can afford to drive them?   

[Handles II]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

How about a separate line that shows all the outsourcing that takes place .  How about a line going about the money given to private corporations through the public schools.   This is a bogus argument not even based on facts.  All of those books are open to the public.  Anyone can see what is going where.  It is not under the table.  Everyday that the bus goes by and drop off the kids at a private school they do it in middle of the day for all the public to see.  Nothing is under the table. 

BTW, that is public transportation for school age kids.   On top of that why am I paying for my neighbor to send his kids on the bus when he makes way more money than me and can afford to drive them?   

Really MarkK, the amount of money given to the private schools is a line item on your property tax bill in plain sight for each property owner to see? If so, your county/district is doing it right. If not, you are lying. I'm betting on the latter.

[bigG]

If the argument is someone needs to be fully taxed to get public money.  Well then you might as well disqualify everyone who gets public money.   I take no offence to your statement g I don't want "public" money.  I do want parents to have a choice.   They can pick what is important to them.   How many public schools pay property taxes or corporate taxes?   I could show you churches that pay more state propery taxes than public schools.   I get that education is a public service.  Even private institutions are providing a public service.   They are not running the public schools out of business.  They just don't subscribe to the big box view of education.  

Not someone, but an institution that profits. There are few churches I know of that are non-profit. They sell a good. Many use that profit to do good things, so do other businesses. This is why those businesses have been able to dip into Public, Voucher and Charter school waters. They profit, pay taxes and throw some money in the school's direction.

I don't think they are running public schools out of business. I think many of what we call "non-profits" are businesses and should be treated as such. If you want the product of the church sold along with the public money, pay the taxes like any other business.

Public schools don't profit from anything but public sector money. They do not sell anything. I would argue most churches sell unity, a connection with God, answers to questions many don't understand, among other things. I've seen some pretty decked out churches with some pretty nice schools attached, with no public money.

If the church affiliated school does take public money, then that should pay the taxes like any other business. I think all churches that take in money should pay taxes on it; including mine. Not trying to offend; but I guess that's my take.

If parents want the religion part added, they can go public and do the religion part separately (like mine did) or pay to have it all included in the education of their kids. Otherwise, it's like having the government pay a business that's non-profit. They probably already do. I'd hate to see that happen in education.

[MarkK]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

How about a separate line that shows all the outsourcing that takes place .  How about a line going about the money given to private corporations through the public schools.   This is a bogus argument not even based on facts.  All of those books are open to the public.  Anyone can see what is going where.  It is not under the table.  Everyday that the bus goes by and drop off the kids at a private school they do it in middle of the day for all the public to see.  Nothing is under the table. 

BTW, that is public transportation for school age kids.   On top of that why am I paying for my neighbor to send his kids on the bus when he makes way more money than me and can afford to drive them?   

Really MarkK, the amount of money given to the private schools is a line item on your property tax bill in plain sight for each property owner to see? If so, your county/district is doing it right. If not, you are lying. I'm betting on the latter.

No I didn't say that what I did say is that I can go and see what is in the books.  they are supposed to be public records.   I NEVER said there was a line item that says that.  don't say I'm lying about something I didn't say. 

[MarkK]

If the argument is someone needs to be fully taxed to get public money.  Well then you might as well disqualify everyone who gets public money.   I take no offence to your statement g I don't want "public" money.  I do want parents to have a choice.   They can pick what is important to them.   How many public schools pay property taxes or corporate taxes?   I could show you churches that pay more state propery taxes than public schools.   I get that education is a public service.  Even private institutions are providing a public service.   They are not running the public schools out of business.  They just don't subscribe to the big box view of education.  

Not someone, but an institution that profits. There are few churches I know of that are non-profit. They sell a good. Many use that profit to do good things, so do other businesses. This is why those businesses have been able to dip into Public, Voucher and Charter school waters. They profit, pay taxes and throw some money in the school's direction.

I don't think they are running public schools out of business. I think many of what we call "non-profits" are businesses and should be treated as such. If you want the product of the church sold along with the public money, pay the taxes like any other business.

Public schools don't profit from anything but public sector money. They do not sell anything. I would argue most churches sell unity, a connection with God, answers to questions many don't understand, among other things. I've seen some pretty decked out churches with some pretty nice schools attached, with no public money.

If the church affiliated school does take public money, then that should pay the taxes like any other business. I think all churches that take in money should pay taxes on it; including mine. Not trying to offend; but I guess that's my take.

If parents want the religion part added, they can go public and do the religion part separately (like mine did) or pay to have it all included in the education of their kids. Otherwise, it's like having the government pay a business that's non-profit. They probably already do. I'd hate to see that happen in education.

I think most of the public schools in my area are in the apparel business.  They sell those and they sell Friday night entertainment which is a bargain for the most part.

[Handles II]

Then there needs to be a separate line item on the tax code indicating the public money going to private schools. The public should be informed. And my guess is that if they were, a much bigger stink would be going on about the vouchers, private schools, and public tax dollars. Keeping it all under the table is a huge advantage for private schools.

How about a separate line that shows all the outsourcing that takes place .  How about a line going about the money given to private corporations through the public schools.   This is a bogus argument not even based on facts.  All of those books are open to the public.  Anyone can see what is going where.  It is not under the table.  Everyday that the bus goes by and drop off the kids at a private school they do it in middle of the day for all the public to see.  Nothing is under the table. 

BTW, that is public transportation for school age kids.   On top of that why am I paying for my neighbor to send his kids on the bus when he makes way more money than me and can afford to drive them?   

Really MarkK, the amount of money given to the private schools is a line item on your property tax bill in plain sight for each property owner to see? If so, your county/district is doing it right. If not, you are lying. I'm betting on the latter.

No I didn't say that what I did say is that I can go and see what is in the books.  they are supposed to be public records.   I NEVER said there was a line item that says that.  don't say I'm lying about something I didn't say. 

See highlighted above. Yes you added in that people should be able to find it via public record. However, my statement was that it isn't on the tax bill and therefore hidden from view and knowledge from the average citizen. Your argument was about line items on the tax bill and you said it was bogus and not fact. It is. In fact, if it hadn't been for me brining it up a couple years ago, there were plenty of people on here who had no idea that privates use money from the public schools or what they are allowed to use it for. And there are some who still deny that it works that way.

[MarkK]

No handles maybe you just misunderstood.  Now you know.   I said that there are public records (or books).   that is what I said.  I was making a point that they don't put line items for where public schools give money to other private organizations.  Like let's say the WIAA.  

[MarkK]

Again you say private schools, when you should be saying American citizens are able to use their tax dollars for legal uses.   American citizens handles.  American tax payers.