Sorry Axford... but...

Scourge · April 16, 2013, 07:22:01 PM

Peralta with a great 1st inning and the Brewers are going to jump on Zito here early on in the 1st. Get an actual WINNING streak going.

Zito is the perfect type of pitcher for the Brewers to get going against. A lefty without a good slider.

Todd · April 16, 2013, 11:08:52 PM

2 in a row baby! Not for a lack of trying to pee away the lead though. Up 9-3 and were still in danger of giving it up in the 9th after Giants get to 10-8. If Axford was going to pitch another inning I was going to be done with this team and Roenke.

Scourge · April 17, 2013, 03:59:13 PM

Quote from: Todd on April 16, 2013, 11:08:52 PM
2 in a row baby! Not for a lack of trying to pee away the lead though. Up 9-3 and were still in danger of giving it up in the 9th after Giants get to 10-8. If Axford was going to pitch another inning I was going to be done with this team and Roenke.

Todd....relax. We had a young, extremely talented pitcher have a bad night and we still beat the defending World Series champs.

And back off Ax a bit. He's coming back around. Another sharp outing last night. Got ahead of hitters again.

He threw TERRIBLY in 2.1 innings. He was outstanding opening day and he's been good the last two times out.

Kintzler threw a scoreless inning, Gorz came in again and looked outstanding, and Henderson gave up his first run of the season.

You're going to have to get used to it. With pitchers like Peralta, they are going to be inconsistent early on. But man, all you had to do was watch that 1st inning. 96 MPH fastball's that were just diving down. Just a HEAVY hard fastball. But his slider and change isn't working for him yet. Lohse is pitching tonight...should give our pen a little break.

And this isn't really important, but it's Roenicke.

Trust me Todd....I told you the Brewers were going to bash Zito, didn't I?

Really though, if we could just be AROUND .500 at the end of May, this team has a chance to compete. Our minor league pitchers are throwing great, we have some young hitters hitting very well, and we'll have Ramirez and Hart back.

How much different does this lineup look if you put a lineup of;
Aoki
Weeks(much better out of the top 2 spots in the order)
Braun
Ramirez
Hart
Lucroy
Gomez
Segura

as opposed to having two weak hitting SS's playing two big time power positions;
Aoki
Segura
Braun
Weeks(can't hit 4/5)
Lucroy
Gonzalez
Gomez
Betancourt

And Gallardo's struggled, you know that won't continue.
Peralta's so ridiculously talented, you'd assume he'd get hot.
Lohse looks like he is the real deal.
Estrada's picking up where he left off...

Throw in Jimmy Nelson, Hellweg, Thornburg, Hunter Morris, Kentrail Davis...any of those guys and this team might be able to give it another run like they did last year when they get healthy.

Stop trying to look at the negatives. HUGE comeback win vs the Cardinals, follow that up with a win over the WS Champs and Barry Zito, a guy who hadn't given up a ER after two straight 7 IP 0ER outings...

Man! Your glass isn't even half full.

That's alright. Just stick it outside for a little while Todd and you might have SOME optimism when we put 10 runs up! I'm half kidding. Lot of the "question marks," are giving us the wrong answer, but it is only 12 games into the season.

Todd · April 17, 2013, 04:06:16 PM

Quote from: Scourge on April 17, 2013, 03:59:13 PM
Quote from: Todd on April 16, 2013, 11:08:52 PM
2 in a row baby! Not for a lack of trying to pee away the lead though. Up 9-3 and were still in danger of giving it up in the 9th after Giants get to 10-8. If Axford was going to pitch another inning I was going to be done with this team and Roenke.

Trust me Todd....I told you the Brewers were going to bash Zito, didn't I?

Really though, if we could just be AROUND .500 at the end of May, this team has a chance to compete. Our minor league pitchers are throwing great, we have some young hitters hitting very well, and we'll have Ramirez and Hart back.

You were right, and I was skeptical given how aweful the bats have been. If the team can be around .500 when Ramirez/Hart come back, I will feel better and that they can compete. It was tough watching the game yesterday though and thinking that a 6 run lead might not be enough. Seriously I would have needed some anger mgt if Axford was left out there for another innning.

Yes I know he had a good innning.

Ghetto · April 17, 2013, 04:08:08 PM

I thought for sure they'd flush that win down the toilet late.

The lineup isn't going to be great until Ramirez and Hart come back. There are too many spots in the lineup where you're like, oh man, it would be nice... rather than expecting guys like Ramirez to produce in the clutch.

The positive to the injuries is getting guys back may boost the morale of the team if they are close. If they are, you never know.

I am just not a big fan of Fiers. I don't know how he can be consistently effective against major league hitters. You can't throw 87 mph high fastballs to guys in the league and get away with it. Yes I get the curveball and eye angle, but the curveball just doesn't look like a fastball, and at 87 guys can still get into the ball fast enough to do damage.

The bullpen is still suspect to me. Gorzelany is pitching well, which is great. Hopefully they'll fall into their roles and won't be a question mark all season.

Scourge · April 17, 2013, 04:26:50 PM

Quote from: Todd on April 17, 2013, 04:06:16 PM
Quote from: Scourge on April 17, 2013, 03:59:13 PM
Quote from: Todd on April 16, 2013, 11:08:52 PM
2 in a row baby! Not for a lack of trying to pee away the lead though. Up 9-3 and were still in danger of giving it up in the 9th after Giants get to 10-8. If Axford was going to pitch another inning I was going to be done with this team and Roenke.

Trust me Todd....I told you the Brewers were going to bash Zito, didn't I?

Really though, if we could just be AROUND .500 at the end of May, this team has a chance to compete. Our minor league pitchers are throwing great, we have some young hitters hitting very well, and we'll have Ramirez and Hart back.

You were right, and I was skeptical given how aweful the bats have been. If the team can be around .500 when Ramirez/Hart come back, I will feel better and that they can compete. It was tough watching the game yesterday though and thinking that a 6 run lead might not be enough. Seriously I would have needed some anger mgt if Axford was left out there for another innning.
Yes I know he had a good innning.

John Axford has has 3 terrible outings and 3 very good outings.

In the 3 outings, I believe all 3 times he was asked to come into the game, and then come back out the next inning. So I'm with you there. He was doing that pretty well a few years ago(getting the last out/two outs of the 8th and then finishing the game) but he can't right now.

And it's not like last year when we SHOULD have been a very-very good team with Yo/Greinke/Marcum/Wolf and Estrada(who's been shockingly good and so under the radar).

I understand the....less than optimistic outlook. I expected 90 wins last year. This year I hope for them to still be close and their pitchers to start pitching well and them to get on a roll.

Scourge · April 17, 2013, 04:33:21 PM

Quote from: Ghetto on April 17, 2013, 04:08:08 PM
I thought for sure they'd flush that win down the toilet late.

The lineup isn't going to be great until Ramirez and Hart come back. There are too many spots in the lineup where you're like, oh man, it would be nice... rather than expecting guys like Ramirez to produce in the clutch.

The positive to the injuries is getting guys back may boost the morale of the team if they are close. If they are, you never know.

I am just not a big fan of Fiers. I don't know how he can be consistently effective against major league hitters. You can't throw 87 mph high fastballs to guys in the league and get away with it. Yes I get the curveball and eye angle, but the curveball just doesn't look like a fastball, and at 87 guys can still get into the ball fast enough to do damage.

The bullpen is still suspect to me. Gorzelany is pitching well, which is great. Hopefully they'll fall into their roles and won't be a question mark all season.

Obviously power pitching is ideal, but you're way TOO hung up on power pitching. Brandon Webb when he was dominating the NL threw 86-87 MPH. Maddux obviously, Glavine, Zito when he was racking up 20 win seasons and Cy Young's.

I'm not sure about anything on Fiers other than he was so impressive to me last year that there is no WAY I can give up on him yet.
He started off poorly last year in the first month as well(like Peralta). And then he was absolutely dominant before he went WAAAY over his previous high in innings pitched and really started to struggle.

If you can throw 89-91, throw your curve and change with the exact same motion and hide your delivery like he does, you can absolutely thrive without great velocity.

Now given the choice, I'd rather take a guy like Jimmy Nelson who can hit 98 MPH, has a Peralta like fastball that is a power sinker and a nasty slider, or Johnny Hellweg who throws even harder with an even better slider. And we may see both those guys, plus a Thornburg pitching in the rotation ahead of Fiers in the next year or two. But GREAT command(not just control, but command) and being able to throw three pitches from the same arm slot can go a LOOOONG way.

That said, I'm still skeptical, but just like when he has 10-12 starts and a 2.00 ERA last year, I'm not going to let less than 10 innings this year convince me one way or the other.

Houndhead · April 17, 2013, 05:18:04 PM

It will be hard to compete for very long with 2 shortstops manning what should be power production positions. I wonder how many teams have their first baseman hitting 8th?

boowrestle · April 17, 2013, 06:10:54 PM

Pretty sure that #8 hitter hit a grand slam last night and doubled in the tying run against cardinals in comeback win,i will take that for now,our #3 and #4 hitters needs to figure things out!!

Ghetto · April 17, 2013, 06:47:45 PM

I'm not hung up on the power aspect as much as the way that Fiers pitches. I just don't think a guy with that repertoire of pitches can make his living throwing the above the waist BP fastball to major league hitters. Guys that venture up that high usually throw it fast enough to throw it by guys.

His last outing was a microcosm of how thing will go for him. Even his outs were well hit.

Ill be ok with being wrong.

Houndhead · April 17, 2013, 07:00:25 PM

Quote from: boowrestle on April 17, 2013, 06:10:54 PM
Pretty sure that #8 hitter hit a grand slam last night and doubled in the tying run against cardinals in comeback win,i will take that for now,our #3 and #4 hitters needs to figure things out!!

So you would be happy with Yuni B in the starting lineup all season?

boowrestle · April 17, 2013, 09:12:55 PM

hounddog,read my entire post its says i can live with it for now

,oh and by the way that #8 hitter homered again tonight!

Todd · April 17, 2013, 09:13:41 PM

Quote from: Houndhead on April 17, 2013, 07:00:25 PM
Quote from: boowrestle on April 17, 2013, 06:10:54 PM
Pretty sure that #8 hitter hit a grand slam last night and doubled in the tying run against cardinals in comeback win,i will take that for now,our #3 and #4 hitters needs to figure things out!!

So you would be happy with Yuni B in the starting lineup all season?

I would not but he did hit another homerun tonight.

Todd · April 17, 2013, 10:08:35 PM

Blake Lalli makes his Miller Park Debut and gets a walk off single over the left fielders head with bases loaded. The game should have been over on the wild throw before that though so justice reigned.

3 in a row.

Houndhead · April 17, 2013, 11:47:37 PM

Quote from: Todd on April 17, 2013, 10:08:35 PM
Blake Lalli makes his Miller Park Debut and gets a walk off single over the left fielders head with bases loaded. The game should have been over on the wild throw before that though so justice reigned.

3 in a row.

The umps got the ruling right. It is two bases from where the runners are when the pitch is delivered.