Author Topic: Could not have said it better....  (Read 18312 times)

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Offline Barou

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #30 on: April 06, 2013, 01:19:24 PM »
There is no way of knowing what Ben would do.  It is just speculation. 

No kidding. Any prediction for anyone not holding a hc position would be speculation. My reasons for my predictions:

Is a bigger name than Barry and most other hc's.
Will recruit the blue-chip wrestlers in wisconsin. He has already recruited more nc's out of wisconsin than Barry (max) to Missouri.
Will improve marketing of the sport.
Has coaching experience at the college level and is still involved in the sport.
Will be more visible in wisconsin (appearances and video)
Results will be better
Attendance will be better

Just my opinion.
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Offline Dale Einerson

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #31 on: April 06, 2013, 01:48:11 PM »
Dale, I was just referring to the nominclature that US News and World Report uses in ranking colleges and universities.  Typically the top 25 schools are considered tier 1 and so on and so forth.  Doesn't mean Wisconsin is a sub-par school, just that Northwestern is a tier 1 school, and Wisconsin is a tier 2 school according to US News and World Report.

Understood, that is one ranking.  There are many rankings that do not put Wisconsin on a different tier other than the top 1. 

Offline padre

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #32 on: April 07, 2013, 02:25:58 AM »
So Ben was an assistant coach and had two at ASU and one at Mizz, admirable.  I would say if a group of individuals hadn't bailed on Barry, he would have done quite well the last couple of years.  This would have made his "track record" pretty darned good.  He is a Head Coach, not an assistant (these are two very different positions).


And this wasn't speculation?

Do you honestly believe if Ben were coach for the UW it wouldn't bring tons of excitement?  I know that is not in the cards at this time but to say this isn't fact is just wrong.

Ben puts himself out there....most are afraid to do that.  Part of the reason he was not as heavily recruited at some schools we have been told.  Love him or hate him he has brought results everywhere he has gone.  Even when coaching his kids(club) at tournaments you can see how much he cares and the passion for the sport.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2013, 02:30:27 AM by padre »

Offline JAMMIN

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #33 on: April 07, 2013, 02:12:13 PM »
So Ben was an assistant coach and had two at ASU and one at Mizz, admirable.  I would say if a group of individuals hadn't bailed on Barry, he would have done quite well the last couple of years.  This would have made his "track record" pretty darned good.  He is a Head Coach, not an assistant (these are two very different positions).

Why the heck do you think these coaches and wrestlers bailed?  They weren't happy with how the program was being run and saw better opportunities.  You do realize that the top recruits didn't come because of Barry, right?

Offline Badger_Fan

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #34 on: April 07, 2013, 03:06:01 PM »
So Ben was an assistant coach and had two at ASU and one at Mizz, admirable.  I would say if a group of individuals hadn't bailed on Barry, he would have done quite well the last couple of years.  This would have made his "track record" pretty darned good.  He is a Head Coach, not an assistant (these are two very different positions).

Why the heck do you think these coaches and wrestlers bailed?  They weren't happy with how the program was being run and saw better opportunities.  You do realize that the top recruits didn't come because of Barry, right?

Yeah, they came in spite of him ...

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #34 on: April 07, 2013, 03:06:01 PM »

Offline dad 2 5

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #35 on: April 07, 2013, 03:09:16 PM »
Back to the same silly stuff on the forum. I like the point of the harm being done as recruits read this junk. You would think that in the UW section that there would be more positive view of the program and school. Maybe those of us that are Badger fan should go to the other forums (MN; MI; IL; Iowa...) and try to stir up junk, granted that is pretty tough to do for MN and Iowa but they to have lost top guys to other programs.
I am glad to see Barry, Trevor and the team moving the program forward.

Offline Scourge

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #36 on: April 07, 2013, 04:24:27 PM »
So Ben was an assistant coach and had two at ASU and one at Mizz, admirable.  I would say if a group of individuals hadn't bailed on Barry, he would have done quite well the last couple of years.  This would have made his "track record" pretty darned good.  He is a Head Coach, not an assistant (these are two very different positions).

Why the heck do you think these coaches and wrestlers bailed?  They weren't happy with how the program was being run and saw better opportunities.  You do realize that the top recruits didn't come because of Barry, right?

Yeah, they came in spite of him ...


Really?  Is that what Destin McCauley told you? 

Did Donny come "in spite," of Barry?

Offline Scourge

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #37 on: April 07, 2013, 04:34:54 PM »
Back to the same silly stuff on the forum. I like the point of the harm being done as recruits read this junk. You would think that in the UW section that there would be more positive view of the program and school. Maybe those of us that are Badger fan should go to the other forums (MN; MI; IL; Iowa...) and try to stir up junk, granted that is pretty tough to do for MN and Iowa but they to have lost top guys to other programs.
I am glad to see Barry, Trevor and the team moving the program forward.

They definitely are in the future and they're really are re-building a very competitive team for the future. 
You lose assistant coaches, usually the people who are primarily responsible for the recruiting, you're usually going to lose of the recruits along with them, however our assistant coaches are certainly showing they're capable of bringing in talent and get this team back to where it was supposed to be the past two years. 

But I've come to the conclusion that those who continually bash the program on THIS forum aren't doing it because "they won't accept," fill in whatever puffed out chest type line you want to as it's obviously doing nothing whatsoever to help the program and only to hurt it. 

Offline Badger_Fan

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #38 on: April 07, 2013, 06:03:28 PM »
So Ben was an assistant coach and had two at ASU and one at Mizz, admirable.  I would say if a group of individuals hadn't bailed on Barry, he would have done quite well the last couple of years.  This would have made his "track record" pretty darned good.  He is a Head Coach, not an assistant (these are two very different positions).

Why the heck do you think these coaches and wrestlers bailed?  They weren't happy with how the program was being run and saw better opportunities.  You do realize that the top recruits didn't come because of Barry, right?

Yeah, they came in spite of him ...


Really?  Is that what Destin McCauley told you? 

Did Donny come "in spite," of Barry?

What is the notation for sarcasm? 

Offline dman

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #39 on: April 07, 2013, 08:57:13 PM »
Curious for some of you on here......and I know this has been asked before but some refuse to answer...so dad 2 5 and scrouge....what would have to happen for you guys to ever feel there should be a change to the head coach of the badgers?  And I am not trying to stir the pot either....but a serious question.

Also, do you guys think that some posters should not be allowed on the forum cause they feel that the badgers need a new head coach?  Should the forum be only for complete supporters of Barry and those who do not have any criticisms of the program and lack of success?  What about where you guys work....should employee's not bring forth criticism if they think things are not going well and could be done different?  Again....serious questions?

Personally I think it only makes things stronger within the program to have those who are critical.  I believe it forces people to rethink about how things are being done and maybe....just maybe....things will change. 

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #39 on: April 07, 2013, 08:57:13 PM »

Offline Badger_Fan

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #40 on: April 07, 2013, 09:26:07 PM »
Curious for some of you on here......and I know this has been asked before but some refuse to answer...so dad 2 5 and scrouge....what would have to happen for you guys to ever feel there should be a change to the head coach of the badgers?  And I am not trying to stir the pot either....but a serious question.

Also, do you guys think that some posters should not be allowed on the forum cause they feel that the badgers need a new head coach?  Should the forum be only for complete supporters of Barry and those who do not have any criticisms of the program and lack of success?  What about where you guys work....should employee's not bring forth criticism if they think things are not going well and could be done different?  Again....serious questions?

Personally I think it only makes things stronger within the program to have those who are critical.  I believe it forces people to rethink about how things are being done and maybe....just maybe....things will change. 

It's one thing to be critical - it's another to be critical on a forum.  Also, it's much different being critical and not willing to do anything about it beyond just griping on a forum. 

Again, the problem with so many of the arguments to "fire Barry" are they are unprovable - if a new coach was here, so and so would have stayed, came here, and won a national title by now, had this, had that ... none of which is provable.  Much easier to say and argue those points. 

Offline hammen

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #41 on: April 07, 2013, 09:29:13 PM »
Curious for some of you on here......and I know this has been asked before but some refuse to answer...so dad 2 5 and scrouge....what would have to happen for you guys to ever feel there should be a change to the head coach of the badgers?  And I am not trying to stir the pot either....but a serious question.

Also, do you guys think that some posters should not be allowed on the forum cause they feel that the badgers need a new head coach?  Should the forum be only for complete supporters of Barry and those who do not have any criticisms of the program and lack of success?  What about where you guys work....should employee's not bring forth criticism if they think things are not going well and could be done different?  Again....serious questions?

Personally I think it only makes things stronger within the program to have those who are critical.  I believe it forces people to rethink about how things are being done and maybe....just maybe....things will change.  

What would you say to a kid who was thinking about committing to UW for wrestling right now? Would you be negative about the program to him? Tell him that the head coach is awful and needs to go? Or would you support him and say it would be a good thing to be a badger and help it get to the top? If you are truly a badger fan and want the program to improve, I would hope you choose the latter. Nothing good would ever come of telling the prospect that UW wrestling is going nowhere under Barry and the staff. If you are supportive of the kid's decision or consideration of UW, then why come on here and call for the coaches head? What does that accomplish? If you really feel that Barry needs to go, voice your opinion to the person who makes that decision. That's the only way to actively go about doing something. Coming on here does and saying that our coaching sucks does nothing but hurt the program (with prospects potentially reading the posts). It's comparable to sitting with other associates at your work and complaining about your superior being a bad manager. It does nothing - it only hurts the attitudes of your peers and those who overhear your blabber. The only way you get anything do is going a step above and voicing your concern to someone with authority to make a change. If this is how you approach criticizing or evaluating a superior in real life (complaining to your peers and those below you), that's too bad.

Most people on here aren't critical in a productive way. I guarantee that the coaching staff and the team are very critical of themselves and are not even close to satisfied with where they finished this year. I have faith that they will continue to grow and achieve more successes each year. I've witnessed and experienced that process under Barry before, and I'm confident that it will happen again with this staff and team.

Offline woody53

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #42 on: April 07, 2013, 09:40:29 PM »
What would you say to a kid who was thinking about committing to UW for wrestling right now? Would you be negative about the program to him? Tell him that the head coach is awful and needs to go? Or would you support him and say it would be a good thing to be a badger and help it get to the top? If you are truly a badger fan and want the program to improve, I would hope you choose the latter. Nothing good would ever come of telling the prospect that UW wrestling is going nowhere under Barry and the staff. If you are supportive of the kid's decision or consideration of UW, then why come on here and call for the coaches head? What does that accomplish? If you really feel that Barry needs to go, voice your opinion to the person who makes that decision. That's the only way to actively go about doing something. Coming on here does and saying that our coaching sucks does nothing but hurt the program (with prospects potentially reading the posts). It's comparable to sitting with other associates at your work and complaining about your superior being a bad manager. It does nothing - it only hurts the attitudes of your peers and those who overhear your blabber. The only way you get anything do is going a step above and voicing your concern to someone with authority to make a change. If this is how you approach criticizing or evaluating a superior in real life (complaining to your peers and those below you), that's too bad.

Most people on here aren't critical in a productive way. I guarantee that the coaching staff and the team are very critical of themselves and are not even close to satisfied with where they finished this year. I have faith that they will continue to grow and achieve more successes each year. I've witnessed and experienced that process under Barry before, and I'm confident that it will happen again with this staff and team.
Great post Drew.
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Offline MNbadger

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #43 on: April 07, 2013, 10:24:17 PM »
Yes, What are some specifics as to why you wouldn't want your son or a wrestler you coach going to UW?
Padre... I doubt Ben has more enthusiasm for the sport than Barry.
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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #43 on: April 07, 2013, 10:24:17 PM »

Offline BuckyMatt

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #44 on: April 07, 2013, 11:19:20 PM »
Curious for some of you on here......and I know this has been asked before but some refuse to answer...so dad 2 5 and scrouge....what would have to happen for you guys to ever feel there should be a change to the head coach of the badgers?  And I am not trying to stir the pot either....but a serious question.

Also, do you guys think that some posters should not be allowed on the forum cause they feel that the badgers need a new head coach?  Should the forum be only for complete supporters of Barry and those who do not have any criticisms of the program and lack of success?  What about where you guys work....should employee's not bring forth criticism if they think things are not going well and could be done different?  Again....serious questions?

Personally I think it only makes things stronger within the program to have those who are critical.  I believe it forces people to rethink about how things are being done and maybe....just maybe....things will change. 

Great questions Dman.  I personally think all should be allowed on this forum, both Barry Fans and those that want him replaced.  I agree that being critical and questioning directions can make things stronger.  However, as many have pointed out and how Drew articulated, it's only going to hurt the program when the conversation is more centered on "Barry Sucks", "Donny did all the work" type negativity as opposed to positive criticism (oxymoron alert) such as we need different marketing, we need to get more fans in the seats, etc.

I think there is a place here for all fans and I honestly respect all others opinions.  Drew is right though, if you want to complain productively, just like in the real world, reach out to Alvarez directly, not people underneath him who have no decision making ability.  I think even Ben A agreed on this.

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Re: Could not have said it better....
« Reply #44 on: April 07, 2013, 11:19:20 PM »