Iowa's agressiveness?????

[mike]

Chedd,u better go back and watch some iowa film they havent been wrestling this style for a long time,looks like watching whole team of ryan morningstars,Brands and steiners the Gable wrestlers never would just push and stall and rely on refs to award them free pts for the win.Iam not complaining,pretty much all of college wrestling has adapted this style,not everybody can wrestle like David Taylor!Dake is going to be surprised by tonights finals results,no 4 timer tonight,Taylor 3/4pts over Dake tonight!

Boo you silly man!

[Scourge]

At what point do we stop complaining about this "new" Iowa style and start figuring out that you need to either match their physicality or be a few points better? Iowa has been doing this for a very long time. Nothing new about it. Don't back up, you put the ref in a position to think you are stalling.

Actually, it's something that's VERY new.....

It's a lot different than they wrestled with Metcalf and guys like that.  They'er not attacking, they're just pushing and blocking...WHICH is stalling.

And it doesn't matter that you've taken every single shot because you backed up for some space?

Point to an individual time in Ramos' semis or finals match where he could have been called for stalling. He isn't stalling, he just isn't taking shots. If you push the action, you get the calls. Whether we like it or, no ref is going to award a stalling call to our guy for backing up and taking one shot the entire match.

Shockingly, Ramos took shots in the finals.

If you read the rules book, constantly.  Blocking and pushing is by definition-stalling. 

Not that Graff doesn't when he gets a lead, but Ramos certainly was.  You can't just block and push and think because you're in the future that's not stalling. 

[Wisconsin Wrestling Fan]

Iowa is living on their past reputation - I think they get calls they shouldn't.  I think they have a strategy sometimes of wrestling for the overtime.

[npope]

If you read the rules book, constantly.  Blocking and pushing is by definition-stalling. 

Not that Graff doesn't when he gets a lead, but Ramos certainly was.  You can't just block and push and think because you're in the future that's not stalling. 

I think you need to take the issue up with the NCAA refs then, Scourge. They seem to be fine with that style of wrestling and don't see any conflict with the rules as written - which they have read.

That said, personally, I would agree with you that a person could be stalling when wrestling in a manner that Ramos does against Graff. I think the main thing that allows him to get away with it is that he is constantly in the future and engaging (while Graff is backing up and not engaging). The ref is thinking, "Hhhmmm, who to call for stalling?" Easy call, quite honestly. Most of the time Graff wasn't being pushed out but rather, he would run to the edge and insist on engaging the action there (and even then, he would only shoot a couple of times during the match). Just not a good strategy.

He lost at the Big Tens with that strategy and as soon as he got a lead in the NCAA match he went back to that strategy again. Sooner or later the coaches and Graff just have to conclude that they need to actually wrestle Ramos for the full seven minutes. I think Graff would do well (or at least better) with that strategy. But then again, I don't know jack; and the coaches are experts so...

[whatever]

Personally I was disappointed in Graff's quarterfinal match when he had 4-0 lead on McCormick from Missouri and he didn't appear to have any sense of urgency to keep wrestling.  Graff was in on a single leg in the second periodand he seemed to be content to let the referee call a stalemate instead of getting another takedown.  That match eneded up 4-2, I believe, and it seemed to me that Graff stopped being aggressive and was content to more or less stall out the last period and a half.

I figured he didn't stand a chance against Ramos if he wrestled only half the match so when he jumped out to that lead in the second period, I thought Graff was clearly in the driver's seat and was going to be advancing to the finals.

.....and then, he went back to not being aggressive and it was very frustrating to watch everything he worked for go out the window.

[Wisconsin Wrestling Fan]

Maybe Tyler Graff needs to watch some of Dan Gable's Iowa team's tapes.

Royce Alger was one of my favorites for his aggressiveness.  He attacked and attacked.  I remember watching an Iowa / Iowa State dual when he stalled out Kevin Jackson.  Alger never quit no matter what the score was.

You need to plan the match to be 11 minutes - If you finish them off in 7 minutes or less, so be it.

[npope]

While I think we all appreciate Alger's aggressiveness, I wouldn't suggest that everybody turn into the Hulk during their matches - not everybody can do what Alger did. And I don't begrudge Graff's strategy to be a bit cautious in his matches and use strategies to leverage situations - I think that is appropriate and the norm. A guy usually shouldn't be taking a shot when he has a one point lead with 15 seconds left. Ty's problem is that he is far too transparent with his strategy when wrestling the top guys; too easy for a ref to see it and call him on it.

But again, I never competed at that level and so I am strictly an arm-chair quarterback on this one. But it just seems so painfully evident as to what is going on in those matches with respect to Ty's strategies and refs aren't likely to let it go for the entire match.

[Todd]

Personally I was disappointed in Graff's quarterfinal match when he had 4-0 lead on McCormick from Missouri and he didn't appear to have any sense of urgency to keep wrestling.  Graff was in on a single leg in the second periodand he seemed to be content to let the referee call a stalemate instead of getting another takedown.  That match eneded up 4-2, I believe, and it seemed to me that Graff stopped being aggressive and was content to more or less stall out the last period and a half.

I figured he didn't stand a chance against Ramos if he wrestled only half the match so when he jumped out to that lead in the second period, I thought Graff was clearly in the driver's seat and was going to be advancing to the finals.

.....and then, he went back to not being aggressive and it was very frustrating to watch everything he worked for go out the window.

+1