Wisconsin High School Rankings - Wednesday, December 22, 2021
https://wiwrestling.com/wiwrestling-com-high-school-rank-12-22-2021/
Who's bright idea was it to put Jacob Ward ranked 10th after beating Kale Roth ranked 4th this weekend. I wonder if you guys actually watch.
There is another wrestler that beat someone that is ranked 4 spots higher.
Yes but Ward's only losses are to the 2nd and 3rd ranked kids. He beat 4th ranked and they put him at 10...
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 22, 2021, 10:54:40 PM
Yes but Ward's only losses are to the 2nd and 3rd ranked kids. He beat 4th ranked and they put him at 10...
Make sure you put in a rankings suggestion before the next rankings come out. I put in the link in for you:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScshliz0Rk1Dxs49qD-VdDORafNUT89SKDwjsoaEz7UCPzxrg/viewform?usp=sf_link
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 22, 2021, 10:54:40 PM
Yes but Ward's only losses are to the 2nd and 3rd ranked kids. He beat 4th ranked and they put him at 10...
I think there is a tournament at the end of the season to determine the final rankings. I hope your feelings have not been hurt by this early season snub in the rankings.
I love it when you guys try to pass these rankings off as oh don't worry it's no big deal ... They do end up on a national database. So stop acting like this is just your little play ground.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 23, 2021, 09:11:36 AM
I love it when you guys try to pass these rankings off as oh don't worry it's no big deal ... They do end up on a national database. So stop acting like this is just your little play ground.
Dude. I am not passing it off. Never said it wasn't a big deal. The rankings committee is not perfect. Bring it to their attention in a respectful manner and they usually fix their mistakes.
What national database do these rankings end up on?
There will always be some mistakes and they all get sorted out and they still will never be perfect at the end.
Imagine ranking 3 divisions x 14 weight classes x 15 wrestlers per weight class plus following another 10 on the watch list.
That is 1,050 wrestlers to follow. This process is done by volunteers doing it on their own time with basically no help from coaches and minimal help from fans. Then you have a lot of stuff that is still not entered on trackwrestling which is basically the only source of information to the ranking committee. Then fans want the rankings by Wednesday after Saturday tournaments
I am sure that Ward would not be ranked 10th if someone had submitted his wins and his losses to the committee.
The real difference is that coaches just don't participate in the process like they do in other sports.
RankWrestlers All-Americans
If it isn't accurate maybe you should let this groups know.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 23, 2021, 01:34:53 PM
RankWrestlers All-Americans
If it isn't accurate maybe you should let this groups know.
I would bet they are using the rankings without the knowledge of the ranking committee from this web site
What I wanted to correct were those that try to say these rankings do not matter. They do show up on national databases and do make a difference. Any time someone makes a claim to rank or compare and document information. They also take on responsibilities of accuracy. I only pointed out one of a few discrepancies that I've seen.
Anyone can say it's too hard to be accurate. That's the point. When someone makes a corrective statement stop saying it doesn't matter and say thank you. Do the further investigation and make the correction. As we can all see now, it really does matter. People are watching these and not just a bunch of old guys with nothing better to do
So do you guys even look at results??? #6 Peters from Kaukauna just beat the #5river falls kid 7-1 at Minnesota Christmas. Also conner smith beat showalter last time they wrestled but were 1-1 against each other that weekend so that's not that bad.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 23, 2021, 04:02:42 PM
What I wanted to correct were those that try to say these rankings do not matter. They do show up on national databases and do make a difference. Any time someone makes a claim to rank or compare and document information. They also take on responsibilities of accuracy. I only pointed out one of a few discrepancies that I've seen.
Anyone can say it's too hard to be accurate. That's the point. When someone makes a corrective statement stop saying it doesn't matter and say thank you. Do the further investigation and make the correction. As we can all see now, it really does matter. People are watching these and not just a bunch of old guys with nothing better to do
I have had 3 sons go through wrestling. They've been ranked anywhere from 1-10 every year. Appreciate the time these people take in what they do. It gives people something to talk about. I used to help Crossface rank...it's very difficult.
However...if you think it matters at all you basically know nothing. Big tournaments don't care...so who does?
I think high schoolers are starting to overtake the board. 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Apparently, you don't read thoroughly, if you had you'd see I explained why it matters and big or even small tournaments were never mentioned. Really, if your going to make snarky remarks make sure you understand the intent.
I had a 220lber win state that year he was never ranked above 11th and it did not stop him from winning. Rankings are just fun to read they do not mean anything except entertainment. Thank you for taking time to do this for us to read.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 22, 2021, 10:54:40 PM
Yes but Ward's only losses are to the 2nd and 3rd ranked kids. He beat 4th ranked and they put him at 10...
Your only option is to quit wrestling. That'll show you mean business. Perhaps cross country sling is a bit less volatile.
Rankings are alot of fun. Are they perfect, probably not but it does make kids day and coaches also. Nice to see kids rewarded or at least some hype with seeing their names up as a top wrestlers state wide.
Good job rankings committee...lots of fun and thanks for the hard work
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 23, 2021, 08:09:53 PM
Apparently, you don't read thoroughly, if you had you'd see I explained why it matters and big or even small tournaments were never mentioned. Really, if your going to make snarky remarks make sure you understand the intent.
I see you're fairly new around here. perhaps your screen name should have been "the grinch?"
In all seriousness, i cant understand why you are so upset. The committee is made up of volunteers who are doing their best. Im sure they dont have time to comb through every single tournament and every single dual. Be kind and send them all of Jacobs results.
Since you can't read and can't understand how they actually do come into play... Maybe you need stronger glasses. I leave it with, I hope the ranking committee will look a little closer in the future.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 24, 2021, 03:21:29 PM
Since you can't read and can't understand how they actually do come into play... Maybe you need stronger glasses. I leave it with, I hope the ranking committee will look a little closer in the future.
It is very hard to keep up with all 300 plus teams and what tournament they are all at. I doubt any one was singling out your favorite wrestler by any means. Rankings have alot of movable parts and very difficult to pin down the exact place everyone is to be ranked at.
Quote from: FinalWord on December 24, 2021, 08:38:00 AM
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 22, 2021, 10:54:40 PM
Yes but Ward's only losses are to the 2nd and 3rd ranked kids. He beat 4th ranked and they put him at 10...
But did the 4th seed beat the second seed or 3rd seed. That is were the condrum come into play.
I remember a couple of years ago a kid came in HM and took third. Beating some high ranked kids along the way. It happened kids get hot at the right time and kids go cold at bad times.
Good luck to your favorite wrestler for the rest of the season.
I think rankings would matter a lot more if the state tournament was seeded (which it should be) but since it's not rankings are really nothing more than a talking point. Is it frustrating seeing kids you yourself have beat ranked while you aren't or your teamates snubbed? Yeah that all sucks but when it comes down to it they are nothing more than a talking point.
Backwards is that new? because I know I'm years past the tournament has not been seeded and either way even if it is seeded this year (thank god as it should be) it doesn't say anywhere on there that "Wisconsin wrestling's online rankings are a determining factor of seeding at the state tournament"
Section results should not be used in seeding. There is too much variation in the comparative quality of sections.
It's not about seeding. Please don't make another ignorant comment until you've read why it actually matters early in the post. Sorry you guys can't see past this state.
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 23, 2021, 01:34:53 PM
RankWrestlers All-Americans
If it isn't accurate maybe you should let this groups know.
Never heard of that website. Had to look it up. You are naive if you think a pay-website such as this has any influence on a wrestler getting recruited. The website says its stats are directly from Trackwrestling not what volunteers list on various ranking websites such as here. It's all driven by statistics directly from Track. Maybe you should be directing your frustration towards that website and not the people here?
Quote from: MNbadger on December 24, 2021, 11:51:06 PM
Section results should not be used in seeding. There is too much variation in the comparative quality of sections.
Trust the system.
Objective criteria that allows every wrestler to build a resume over three months to earn an appropriate line on the state bracket.
Probably means this year will be the best overall state finals in 40 years!
Quote from: NEW_Wrestling on December 25, 2021, 12:06:23 AM
It's not about seeding. Please don't make another ignorant comment until you've read why it actually matters early in the post. Sorry you guys can't see past this state.
I'm sorry you don't understand RankWrestlers, and that you are angry enough to complain about the rankings, but not seemingly angry enough to provide feedback via the method shared multiple times. Complaining on the forum wasn't the method requested BTW. RankWrestlers is purely data drive from results, and competitors results to provide a calculated rank. It doesn't consider any independent human based ranking systems at all. Zero. The All America section is simply the wrestlers who rank 99.0 on their ranking system. It's an interesting system, I look at it as I look at the rankings here. Neither of them are more important than the on the mat results.
There are 588 wrestlers in the rankings every week. I'm sorry you think a group of volunteers is going to have time to look at every one of those wrestlers results. My advice to you if you care about the accuracy of the rankings and matter as much as you believe they do, is to contribute information to the ranking committee as has been requested multiple times. Do it with less negativity and whining than you have posted on here about it, and I'm sure your input will be considered, perhaps even valued. As has already been mentioned, the committee is a group of volunteers, not people with full time jobs doing wrestling rankings, so help out. You have already spent 10x more time complaining on this thread than it would have taken to go fill out the form to submit recommendations to the committee and help improve the rankings. It's potentially going to get even crazier the next couple weeks as wrestlers start dropping weight classes, and I'm sure thoughtful, well intended suggestions would be appreciated.
Quote from: BackwardsHatAttack on December 24, 2021, 09:42:39 PM
Quote from: ObsessedObserver on December 24, 2021, 09:34:20 PM
I think rankings would matter a lot more if the state tournament was seeded (which it should be) but since it's not rankings are really nothing more than a talking point. Is it frustrating seeing kids you yourself have beat ranked while you aren't or your teamates snubbed? Yeah that all sucks but when it comes down to it they are nothing more than a talking point.
Umm....
https://www.wiaawi.org/Portals/0/PDF/Publications/Winter_Sport_Regs/wrestlingtournregs.pdf
Page 53.
b. Tournament Pairings
At the individual state tournament, seeding criteria will be used for all competitors. Trackwrestling will seed all 16 wrestlers in D1 and seed all 12 wrestlers in D2 and D3 at the Individual State Tournament using the following criteria:
(1) Head-to-head competition
(2) Competition against common opponents
(3) Returning state champion
(4) Returning second or third place finisher in previous season
(5) Returning fourth through sixth place finisher from previous season
(6) Sectional champion
(7) Returning state qualifier in previous season
(8) Winning percentage in the current season
I wonder if this will be on a 13 ish point system like other states?
example:
You can earn 7-8 points from head to head competition (with other guys in the bracket).
Returning State champ gets 3-4 points
Returning state qualifier 1 point
Section champ 1 point
winning % gets you .5 to 1 point between the top 8 seeds.
If this is how it goes you will see wrestlers that are 42-0 on light schedules may only come into state with a couple seeding points.The new seeding system will favor good coaches that go out and schedule their season to find head to head points, if you have a lazy coach you are screwed.
I hope this is the start of a much better wrestling culture in Wisconsin and the day of protecting great records is over!!!