at Michigan, 1-23-15

[sudden_victory]

This could be an ignorant question but I'm not a wrestler I'm a wrestler's dad-- could he be caught in a conflict of trying to avoid using Greco techniques in order to push himself to develop better folk style moves, and now his timing is screwed up? Maybe that could eventually work out for the good.

[Briopiate]

It seems to me like he just can't get wrestling down on the mat...He seems good enough on top to get NF points etc.., but he just has no weapons on bottom....could it be a chronic injury related thing? He just doesn't seem to have any urgency on bottom...does he just not get it? It would seem that after a few years in a college wrestling room he would at least show some improvement in getting off bottom...I wonder if that's on JT or on the coaches..or both? He's great on his feet that's for sure.

[npope]

It seems to me like he just can't get wrestling down on the mat...He seems good enough on top to get NF points etc.., but he just has no weapons on bottom....could it be a chronic injury related thing? He just doesn't seem to have any urgency on bottom...does he just not get it? It would seem that after a few years in a college wrestling room he would at least show some improvement in getting off bottom...I wonder if that's on JT or on the coaches..or both? He's great on his feet that's for sure.

His placing at the Midlands two years ago would suggest that he was at least competent at getting out from under at that time - so I don't think the issue is a lack of skills. If I were a betting man, I might bet on a shortage of self-confidence at this point. Hard to know what goes on in a young man's head.

[dietac]

I think it's possible that greco is his passion and this just isn't that important to him. It's even possible that he thinks this is hindering his greco progress. It would make the "buying in" comment make some sense.

[aarons23]

We have seen many times that many people who had very impressive accolades in high school didn't cut it in college.  To think that there were a couple of bone heads on this forum who claimed he would win 4 national titles is beyond comical.  At this point his chances of qualifying for nationals this year are slim to none.  Everyone in Division 1 wrestling is talented and all of these guys have the same pressures of being in school, girls, partying, etc etc.  It comes down to how you deal with it.  At the end of the day its kind of simple.  How hard are you willing to work and how bad do you want it?  State championships are a dime a dozen in college wrestling and no one is intimidated by that. 

I'm just wondering how many national titles you won in college? Hecht how about All American....you seem so confident on what the problem us you surely must have experience....why don't you come from behind your screen name and tell us of your accolades?

[billymurphy]

I admit, I honestly thought Dieringer had a shot at winning four NCAA titles.
The way that he could go through Fargo with such ease really impressed me.

I watched this wrestling movie named, "Takedowns and Falls", about this Pennsylvania
high school wrestling team that had a really determined coach.  This high
school coach said your desire to get off the bottom needs to be the desire
you would have as if your head was underwater and you have to get out
so you can breathe.  Thielke needs to watch that movie as when you
watch Thielke on bottom you would think he is perfectly happy
just letting the guy pound on him and shows no effort to get out.
Never ever let somebody pound on you like that.  Get out!

[MNbadger]

I know this will make others a bit crazy but I have no doubt his size plays into this too.  Someone thinks he is "between weights".  Look at C.Dardanes at 133.  JT is nowhere near his size, a bit taller but that's it.  Then compare him to N. Dardanes at 141 (or any other Big Ten 141 pounder).  JT would not be a giant at 133, probably about average in fact.
Certain very dominant wrestlrs can have success wrestling up but the vast, vast majority need to be down to their minmum weight to be successful.
He may not be happy wrestling collegiately either.  Without the drive, it doesn't matter how talented you are, it is tough, tough, tough!

[Wisconsin Wrestling Fan]

I admit, I honestly thought Dieringer had a shot at winning four NCAA titles.
The way that he could go through Fargo with such ease really impressed me.

I watched this wrestling movie named, "Takedowns and Falls", about this Pennsylvania
high school wrestling team that had a really determined coach.  This high
school coach said your desire to get off the bottom needs to be the desire
you would have as if your head was underwater and you have to get out
so you can breathe.  Thielke needs to watch that movie as when you
watch Thielke on bottom you would think he is perfectly happy
just letting the guy pound on him and shows no effort to get out.
Never ever let somebody pound on you like that.  Get out!

I saw a wrestling movie a few years back "Win Win" http://news.moviefone.com/2011/01/22/win-win-review/ about a high school team that was not very good, but then a kid that was an outstanding wrestler moved to town.  At one of the practices, the kid was on the bottom, and he got out with a flurry of action.  The head coach, Paul Giamatti, asked " What was that move?  and the kid said "Get the (blank) out of there" and that is what they started practicing !!

[wrestle03]

Aarons23, as Ive told you before, you should concentrate more of your efforts on the VMI wrestling program and not the Badgers.
I was never the caliber of JT but Ive got a couple state titles that you cant take away from me.  I'm entitled to my opinion, and my opinion is he's not 100% committed and his heart isn't in it.  If that's the case, fine, concentrate on Greco and move on.
I am looking forward to following VMI!

[jaguarwrestler]

I know this will make others a bit crazy but I have no doubt his size plays into this too.  Someone thinks he is "between weights".  Look at C.Dardanes at 133.  JT is nowhere near his size, a bit taller but that's it.  Then compare him to N. Dardanes at 141 (or any other Big Ten 141 pounder).  JT would not be a giant at 133, probably about average in fact.
Certain very dominant wrestlrs can have success wrestling up but the vast, vast majority need to be down to their minmum weight to be successful.
He may not be happy wrestling collegiately either.  Without the drive, it doesn't matter how talented you are, it is tough, tough, tough!

he did wrestle half his matches as a freshman at 141

maybe he doesn't like to cut weight, or maybe cutting weight each week is not good for him, never had to in HS so this is a new experience and maybe he doesn't do well with it. Dardanes I believe is killing himself to make 133, I could be wrong, Lubeck I'm sure struggle to make 141 and it didn't work out. May have been better for him to bulk up and be a huge 149.

maybe he is like Garrett Lowney, not trying to bulk up to a big 141 because he wants to wrestle 132 in Greco... I would guess Lowney never tried to get huge for NCAA because he wanted to wrestle Internationally at a weight that is between 197 and full HWT, this hurt him against the big guys.

we could speculate all day, each person deals with situations differently.

[aarons23]

Aarons23, as Ive told you before, you should concentrate more of your efforts on the VMI wrestling program and not the Badgers.
I was never the caliber of JT but Ive got a couple state titles that you cant take away from me.  I'm entitled to my opinion, and my opinion is he's not 100% committed and his heart isn't in it.  If that's the case, fine, concentrate on Greco and move on.
I am looking forward to following VMI!

You have taken more shots at JT than anyone.....stop hiding behind your screen name.....obviously you never competed at the level JT has....and never will.  So you have no idea what it takes. Your constant degrading him is pathetic and cowardly from behind a computer.

Btw....I follow VMI pretty closely....and I don't see any wanna be fans like you bashing the wrestlers.

[MNbadger]

Jaguar, I agree with your post.  
My point is, it doesn't help to wrestle too heavy in NCAA wrestling.  Even a wrestler like Ness who is pretty dominating would win much less at 165.  This is not even considering it is tougher to go up a weight when you are at one of the lighter weight classes vs one of the heavier weight classes.

"Dardanes I believe is killing himself to make 133"

I would suspect many if not most are "killing themselves" to make weight.  No one does it (weight cutting) for fun.

[Wisconsin Wrestling Fan]

Hand control, putting 3 moves together, fire off the whistle, head up, back pressure, break the grip on the hip... Practice, Practice, Practice...  Blast out of there !! 

We've all heard the routine - it's easier said than done... everyone thats starts in the Big 10 is pretty good... 

[billymurphy]

Thielke's matches all follow the same pattern and the coaching staff needs to correct it
or it will be a long season.  When Thielke is on the bottom he does not use hand control, and
does not show any effort to get out.  He has two things working against him: 1) He was almost
never taken down in high school so he never had to learn it and #2) In Greco you generally do
not use hand control or fire out to get out of there.
Thus, in conclusion, his bottom skills appear to me to be a major problem, and if
he gets that solved, the sky is the limit.
Naturally this is just my opinion and there could easily be other factors that the coaching
staff has not mentioned that is impacting his wrestling. It is a mystery how Lantz
can hang with Thielke after only a few weeks of college practice during the wrestle offs.  I also did not see that
Thielke was significantly bigger than Lantz at 133 and it was alarming to me that Lantz was
able to ride Thielke.  I attributed it to either weight cutting or early season conditioning but
there is more to it than just that. Add in the fact that the rest of the guys on the team seem to
be doing so well and the Badgers will need Thielke at 100 percent when we go against Illinois,
if we expect to beat them.

[Wrestling fan]

Why does every subject on here have to get turned into a JT explosion of would of, could of, should of. Yes he was very good in hs, yes we all want him to do well, leave the kid alone and let him figure it out! If you were a struggling wrestler with the background he has and read these comments, what would it do to your confidence? None of us know what it like, we're all just fans. Let's talk about the subject Wisconsin vs michigan .