Just curious.
I am a relative newbie to college wrestling. Been following for about 3-4 years. At first I was disappointed with this program. All I had to compare to was Hoops and football. My family and I have had season tickets for 20+ years for those events. I could not figure out the differences in why those other programs were so successful and wrestling was not. I think with RT, Zeke, Ricky and Medberry this was a good year. The key with all of this is recruits. Hopefully with some success the recruits will come. With basketball and football they nail down most of the in state young men. Wrestling just does not seem to have a lot of area kids to choose from. Would love to have a couple of kids that left on this team leading the way this year. You just can't have the "empty weight" divisions and expect to compete with the Iowa & Penn States of the world. Like Ohio St will be in football-will be very tough to compete with them every year.
No, but that makes me a Barry hater I guess.
Congrats to Issac Jordan on his BIG 10 championship and the rest of the guys that qualified for NCAA's
I think we could have taken 6/7 if Timmy didn't get hurt and Medberry finished a little better( I hate losing to Telford)I don't view it as a failure for the struggles that happened this season. There was turmoil in the lineup with people moving around. JJ wasn't even supposed to be wtestling this year, but this will benefit him next year. I see lots of room for improvement. 7 out of 10 are underclass men! I want wisco to win a championship, but it doesn't happen overnight! It's easy to see that the team is headed in the right direction. Enjoyed watching this weekend overall the team was aggressive and exciting!
I think there is a complicated answer to a simple question. Maybe not satisfied but I think it is deeper than just the 8th place finish so I thought I would look at the season to date and where the team is at looking forward. Six qualifiers with 3 being first time qualifiers, should have 3 top 5 seeds, and 5 will be returning with 4 being freshman or sophomores.
125 – certainly would have expected more with RT returning there but based on how things turned out. I think the outcome is right where you would have expected it to be
133 – RT certainly exceeded expectations up to this point
141 – JT had an up and down season but had a nice showing at the Big Tens and is making his first trip to the NCAA's
149 – Certainly expecting more hear and would hope to have more success here next year
157 – Need improvement here for next season
165 – what needs to be said?
174 – Was not sure who would be in the lineup here but I thought Frank finished out his career with a nice season. Depending on the how the weights shake out next year could see improvement here as well
184 – RR exceeded expectations to this point
197 – up and down year for Timmy. Some great matches and some I am sure he would like to have back. Not sure who will be in at this weight next year
285 – probably right at expectations right now. Definitely some disappointment with 2 losses at the Big Tens but he is right there and anything is possible at the NCAA's. The top 5 guys are very close
Pro:I am proud of our guys. Jordan with a first. Taylor with a second, Medbery with a 4th, Robertson with a 5th,
and Thielke with two pins for 8th.
Con: The Badger seniors went out like a lamb rather than a lion.
-Half the lineup is studs, the other half is not(yet).
The team will finish higher than 8th place next year.
Iowa and Penn State and Ohio State are Dang near a certain top 3 so even a great Badger team would finish only fourth.
The Badgers have some very good true freshman on the roster that will eventually become solid starters.
The roster could be a little weak potentially at 141 or maybe 197 assuming Thielke spends his time working on Greco.
Comment: Observing the way Sanderson and Brands recruit vs. the way Barry recruits,
based on observation and history, I say that once Medbery graduates that it will be
two full of seasons before the Badgers find a heavyweight that places in the top 8 in the Big Ten Tournament.
Quote from: wrastle63 on March 08, 2015, 10:18:28 PM
I think we could have taken 6/7 if Timmy didn't get hurt and Medberry finished a little better( I hate losing to Telford)I don't view it as a failure for the struggles that happened this season. There was turmoil in the lineup with people moving around. JJ wasn't even supposed to be wtestling this year, but this will benefit him next year. I see lots of room for improvement. 7 out of 10 are underclass men! I want wisco to win a championship, but it doesn't happen overnight! It's easy to see that the team is headed in the right direction. Enjoyed watching this weekend overall the team was aggressive and exciting!
12 points out of 7th, both Medberry and TM could have done a little better and we where still going to be 8th.
Quote from: jaguarwrestler on March 09, 2015, 07:09:42 AM
Quote from: wrastle63 on March 08, 2015, 10:18:28 PM
I think we could have taken 6/7 if Timmy didn't get hurt and Medberry finished a little better( I hate losing to Telford)I don't view it as a failure for the struggles that happened this season. There was turmoil in the lineup with people moving around. JJ wasn't even supposed to be wtestling this year, but this will benefit him next year. I see lots of room for improvement. 7 out of 10 are underclass men! I want wisco to win a championship, but it doesn't happen overnight! It's easy to see that the team is headed in the right direction. Enjoyed watching this weekend overall the team was aggressive and exciting!
12 points out of 7th, both Medberry and TM could have done a little better and we where still going to be 8th.
Jesse also medical forfeited his last match. That could have helped as well, as his match should have been winnable. Either way, to be able to get close to OSU, Iowa, Minnesota, or PSU like some want, we need more out of our in state talent. With the scholarship limitations in wrestling, it significantly helps to have a lot of in state talent.
That said, it is hard to argue with the success and improvement Jordan, Taylor and Medberry have had this year. All have improved a quite a bit. There may not be a wrestler in college this year who has improved as much as Taylor has this year. Robertson also had a very successful year considering he is only a redshirt freshman. We need to add more talented wrestlers to this group to be at the level many want. Hopefully Christensen will be one of those guys next year...it appears he has the potential to do good things at the big 10 level.
I won't sugar coat like the rest of you ;D
Not sure why so many give JJ a free pass just because he is a freshman, many true freshman have been AA's, some Champions... not saying that should have been him but I expected better than 1 win as a starter. This is not just any freshman, he was 4 timer I believe as well as very high placement at Ironman, Dvorak and Cheesehead for multiple years. I cut some slack when considering he didn't get to wrestle in the first 2 tournaments and came into the schedule at a tough time. I will say he has been in most matches, not getting blown out, not giving up bonus points. I think he has a bright future but might be 2 years from now before we see it.
133- Beast, probably my favorite wrestler, just love his style, goes hard and when he does a move it is all the way.
141- give him the 3 tournaments and he likely goes .500 or better, still below what I had hoped but I feel he is dealing with something on and off the mat. Great B1G for him, maybe the best on the team as far as seed vs place, stuck 2 pretty decent wrestlers and wrestle neck and neck with the other 2
149- after Rylan's finish last year I hoped for more, I'm a big fan, think he just needs to let it rip, if he was as aggressive as Taylor he would have a completely different result.
157- Wrestled well considering, I see a different starter here next year but this weight is a total toss up at this point.
165- Beast, great way to come back after getting stuck. I see a top 4 here
174- Wrestled well, as expected for the season
184- I was holding back judgment heading into the B1G, he didn't really wrestle anyone in the top 10 and struggled a bit on the wrestlers 11-20 so I wasn't sure he was fully tested yet. Thought he wrestled very well, think he might be a year out yet from AA contention but very bright future.
197- Not sure what happened, seems like the wheels kind of fell off since the Midlands, 18-2 going into the Midlands final... 3-8 since, hope he gets a WC but if something major doesn't change in the next 2 weeks I don't see more that 1-2 at the NCAA
HWT - Top 4 here are all about equal, in 2 weeks Medberry could be 1st or 6th I think the weight is that close that it just depends how things shake out. Have a great season so far, hope it ends on a high note.
I predicted 8th a month ago, even though this was the year we where waiting for. Just seemed like another typical year for Barry, finished below expectations and in the middle of the pack yet again. Look for another 12-17 at the NCAA's
Put me in the "certainly disappointed" category although the result was no surprise and not expected.
I am just a bit tired of the Badger philosophy that only March counts and then this is your result like you expect something different. The top teams treat every match and every dual as important. For the record, I am not sure if it is fans on this forum or the program itself but it seems both have the philosophy that only March counts.
You have to flatter the best by copying what they do rather than trying to do your own thing. I am not smart enough to realize what has been missing in the program compared to what others are doing. The Big Ten is an elite conference and will always be tough to break into the top. On a national level I just can't accept being behind schools like Cornell, Lehigh, Missouri, Virginia Tech, Edinboro, etc.
If Missouri and Cornell can break into that top then the Badgers certainly should be able to.
Quote from: mkm13 on March 09, 2015, 07:25:00 AM
Quote from: jaguarwrestler on March 09, 2015, 07:09:42 AM
Quote from: wrastle63 on March 08, 2015, 10:18:28 PM
I think we could have taken 6/7 if Timmy didn't get hurt and Medberry finished a little better( I hate losing to Telford)I don't view it as a failure for the struggles that happened this season. There was turmoil in the lineup with people moving around. JJ wasn't even supposed to be wtestling this year, but this will benefit him next year. I see lots of room for improvement. 7 out of 10 are underclass men! I want wisco to win a championship, but it doesn't happen overnight! It's easy to see that the team is headed in the right direction. Enjoyed watching this weekend overall the team was aggressive and exciting!
12 points out of 7th, both Medberry and TM could have done a little better and we where still going to be 8th.
Jesse also medical forfeited his last match. That could have helped as well, as his match should have been winnable. Either way, to be able to get close to OSU, Iowa, Minnesota, or PSU like some want, we need more out of our in state talent. With the scholarship limitations in wrestling, it significantly helps to have a lot of in state talent.
That said, it is hard to argue with the success and improvement Jordan, Taylor and Medberry have had this year. All have improved a quite a bit. There may not be a wrestler in college this year who has improved as much as Taylor has this year. Robertson also had a very successful year considering he is only a redshirt freshman. We need to add more talented wrestlers to this group to be at the level many want. Hopefully Christensen will be one of those guys next year...it appears he has the potential to do good things at the big 10 level.
with JT 7th, Med 3rd and TM say... 7th I believe we still finish 8th
I guess I also am a bit surprised that just because of the year he has now fans are excited about what Thielke did. Remember what the expectations were for him fair or not fair. He was a top ranked recruit that nobody was going to expect the fan base to be happy with an 8th place finish in the Big Ten Tournament.
Jaguar is right in that many of these top teams are just that because they somehow recruit and train freshman to be ready to score big points and compete immediately.
Quote from: DocWrestling on March 09, 2015, 08:37:38 AM
I guess I also am a bit surprised that just because of the year he has now fans are excited about what Thielke did. Remember what the expectations were for him fair or not fair. He was a top ranked recruit that nobody was going to expect the fan base to be happy with an 8th place finish in the Big Ten Tournament.
Jaguar is right in that many of these top teams are just that because they somehow recruit and train freshman to be ready to score big points and compete immediately.
I don't want to give JT a free pass for his season, based on his true freshman year and even last year I thought I would see a top 4 finish for him in the B1G this year. I hate to pile on him because I think his head is beating him more than his talent level. I'm not sure if it is burnout, head, heart, mental block, college life, family life or what, but obviously watching him wrestle something is definitely off. I think he wrestled this weekend as I expected him to wrestle all season. Although I believe he should have beat Purdue.
I think yesterday 5-6 freshman where in the finals... if they all started last year I bet they would have done well.
Try this on for size... PSU lost 5 AA's from last year, they also lost Alton and still finished 3 spots ahead of us.
I'm a big BD supporter but 8th is not good enough and I would hope the coaching staff would say the same. Too much disparity in the performance of the team, some absolute studs and some major holes in the lineup.
With the scoring of NCAA's, having just a few studs who all AA could be enough for a higher finish!
Go Badgers
Ohio St has always been like the Badgers and now they are Big Ten Champs! That needs to be a closer reality for UW.
I will say I am a Barry fan-but this was not a good showing overall besides the big 3. It was preached all year about all that matters is March and they even changed their schedule around to be prepared for the Big 10s and the NCAA's. 4 out of 10 laid an egg. Thielke and Frank wrestled ok, and the Big 3 did great-285 the top 4 would be a different outcome every time hopefully Connor is on the higher end in a couple of weeks, Zeke-what else do you say, I love his attitude and hard nosed style, and RT is exciting and i could see that being the National final as well, it was a lot closer than the score indicates.
Look at Michigan......
4th place overall, with finishes of 5th, 7th, NP, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 1st, 5th, 3rd.
The point is that you don't necessarily need a whole team of Zeke's for a upper echelon conference finish. I think we the fans get caught up in the thought that UW needs 5 in the finals with 3 champs to "make it to the next level". A team contributing points at mostly every weight class can push the UW into the top half.
I can understand the people out there that have grown tired of the "next year" blathering. BUT.......could the UW see a Michigan type B1G tournament next year? Is it reasonable to hope for (expect) a conference placing wrestler at 8 or 9 weight classes, with a legit shot with 1 or 2 making the finals? Is it reasonable to hope for (expect) that type of performance year after year?
Not really ok with it but there were holes in this lineup at the beginning of the year and no one stepped up at 149 and 157. I also think JJ could have stepped up a little bit more to fill the void at 125. Timmy McCall really wrestled poorly the last half of the year, he is guy that is a top four talent in the Big Ten but could never translate that ability to the mat. I think Medberry slipped up at the Big Tens, it might be a mental edge that he is lacking in big tournaments, hopefully it gets fixed by Nationals because he should be standing pretty high on the podium.
Some how I just don't think Barry Davis gets the most out of his talent in the wrestling room. I do believe there is talent in that wrestling room, talent that could compete for a top 5 in the Big Tens but as always it seems to regress at Wisconsin. I think it is time for a new face of Wisconsin Wrestling. I have always liked Barry's energy and enthusiastic nature but I just can't be happy with the results anymore. Taylor was right in that match and kept getting in trouble with the low single and lost it in the last 30 seconds, Ike wrestled well to win, and Medberry needed to get over the hump and win the Big Tens. Maybe a better head coach could make the jump needed in these wrestling careers.
NO!
Huge Badger fan and I like Barry and staff but look at this with me:
(pre-seed)
125 (9) JJ loss to champ and 6th, expected more, he compete hard and is close but needs the winning mental game. Missing the early season starts made the difference I hope for next year
133 (2) GREAT JOB RT!
141 (13) nice tournament and up the most from seed but could have had more and would expect more
149 (8) Loss to 2nd and 3rd, no doubt the toughest draw of all the tournament, with a different draw he could have been there
157 (12) even with seed but...
165 (2) GREAT JOB ZEKE!!
174 (8) FC did alright in meeting his seed
184 (3) loss to 1st and 3rd, good tournament but would have like a little more
197 (8) ouch! in both physical and on the mat, seem issue from first year out, mental block of some sort
H (1) ok, HWY in the B!G is ridiculously tough, need big NCAA
So it looks like 4 meet or better their seed; 2 close; 4 below but that is not the problem. To me the problem is getting prepared and having better seeds. We need the 4-6 seeds throughout the line up with 3-4 stud, then you have a team right there. So will we have them next year? See following post.
125 Jimenez (so) Stickley (F)
133 Taylor (J) Lantz (RsF)
141 Lantz (RsF) Crone (So)
149 Lubeck (J)
157 Ruschell (J) Donar (So) Scharenbrock (RsF)
165 Jordan (J) Liegel (So)
174 Stilling (So) Quintanilla (F)
184 Robertson (So) Christensen (RsF) or at 174
197 Ritter (F) Peissig (So) Velling (J)
H Medberry (Sr) Horwth (Sr)
How do you feel about that, 4 top 3 guys in Taylor, Jordan, Robertson, Medberry and three that should compete top 6 in Jimenez, Lantz, Lubeck would make for an ok B1G
Quote from: dad 2 5 on March 09, 2015, 05:25:44 PM
125 Jimenez (so) Stickley (F)
133 Taylor (J) Lantz (RsF)
141 Lantz (RsF) Crone (So)
149 Lubeck (J)
157 Ruschell (J) Donar (So) Scharenbrock (RsF)
165 Jordan (J) Liegel (So)
174 Stilling (So) Quintanilla (F)
184 Robertson (So) Christensen (RsF) or at 174
197 Ritter (F) Peissig (So) Velling (J)
H Medberry (Sr) Horwth (Sr)
How do you feel about that, 4 top 3 guys in Taylor, Jordan, Robertson, Medberry and three that should compete top 6 in Jimenez, Lantz, Lubeck would make for an ok B1G
Why don't you have JT listed?
I would imagine JT will be taking his Olympic Redshirt next season. I also wouldn't be surprised to see Connor take one as well and let HWT clear out a bit. I think Brock is more than capable to handle a full season at HWT.
125 JJ
133 RT
141 JL
149 RL, AC Don't think you'll see him at 141
157 JD, TR
165 IJ
174 JS, RC
184 RR
197 Peissig, HR
H Horwath
No love for Luke Rowh? I think he is 8-0 in opens this year and should be in the mix at 141.
pretty sure the plan is USA team training for JT. Interesting on Connor. Not sure what his plan is. If Ricky has another great summer I wonder if he would think about it too?
Nope..Not Ok
The chorus has begun once again...For those newer to the program we have been hearing this for two decades...We are young, just wait, have faith....BLAH BLAH BLAH.
INSANITY=same results over and over
Congrats to those that were able to achieve and good luck at Nationals.
Very happy with the out of state kids. Disappointed with the in state kids. For WI to become elite, the in state kids have to step up.
I believe we had a watered down schedule and it still didn't help us, we had some regress or underperform thus hurting our seeds and placement. I believe we had 4 or 5 wrestlers underperform this year and I believe if they where on the other 4 or 5 top teams in the B1G it would be a different story. I believe Barry is a good person, but I have said it before that I don't believe he has the ability to get the most out of his wrestlers. We can talk all day about him being a good mentor, I don't see that as his job, well at least not the most important part of his job... these young men are 19-23 years old they had plenty of time to be mentored by parents, family, friends, teachers, coaches in their past.
Once Barry realizes that all matches matter and not just March it might help the team. Losing matches you should win doesn't help, it hurts. Win a few more matches gets your a better seed and likely a better result. No way this team should have finished 8th but you could see it coming as the year progressed.
Quote from: wrestler_73 on March 09, 2015, 09:10:33 PM
The chorus has begun once again...For those newer to the program we have been hearing this for two decades...We are young, just wait, have faith....BLAH BLAH BLAH.
INSANITY=same results over and over
I do not think this is completely accurate. UW was 2nd at the Big Ten tournament in 07 and 4th at the NCAA's in 2010. 2012 and 2013 were rough but things are definitely on the upswing. Several very high end recruits ended up not wrestling here and that has caused a setback for sure. The ones I am thinking of have not really had D1 success anywhere yet so I do not think you can put that on the coaching staff.
If you look back at previous coaches and the number of AA's there really is not a lot of difference. I would certainly think 3 AA's this year is a reasonable expectation. Consider that 3 or more has only happened 13 times before ever. If that happens you would have to consider this year a success historically. Just wanted to add some historical context.
George Martin
0,0,0,0,0,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,2,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,0
Duane Kleven 2.17 ave
0,0,1,1,3,3,3,4,4,5,1,1
Russ Hellickson 2.25 ave
1,5,2,1
Andy Rein 2.00 ave
2,3,2,1,1,3,2
Barry Davis 1.95 ave (2.5 ave over the last 6 years) (2.3 ave over the last decade)
2,2,2,2,2,2,1,3,2,1,1,0,2,2,2,2,3,4,4,1,1,2,?
Quote from: vsmf2010 on March 11, 2015, 02:16:21 PM
Quote from: wrestler_73 on March 09, 2015, 09:10:33 PM
The chorus has begun once again...For those newer to the program we have been hearing this for two decades...We are young, just wait, have faith....BLAH BLAH BLAH.
INSANITY=same results over and over
I do not think this is completely accurate. UW was 2nd at the Big Ten tournament in 07 and 4th at the NCAA's in 2010. 2012 and 2013 were rough but things are definitely on the upswing. Several very high end recruits ended up not wrestling here and that has caused a setback for sure. The ones I am thinking of have not really had D1 success anywhere yet so I do not think you can put that on the coaching staff.
If you look back at previous coaches and the number of AA's there really is not a lot of difference. I would certainly think 3 AA's this year is a reasonable expectation. Consider that 3 or more has only happened 13 times before ever. If that happens you would have to consider this year a success historically. Just wanted to add some historical context.
George Martin
0,0,0,0,0,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,2,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,0
Duane Kleven 2.17 ave
0,0,1,1,3,3,3,4,4,5,1,1
Russ Hellickson 2.25 ave
1,5,2,1
Andy Rein 2.00 ave
2,3,2,1,1,3,2
Barry Davis 1.95 ave (2.5 ave over the last 6 years) (2.3 ave over the last decade)
2,2,2,2,2,2,1,3,2,1,1,0,2,2,2,2,3,4,4,1,1,2,?
OK, now what is the TEAMS average finish the last 20 years, in the big ten tourney, and NCAA tourney?
Quote from: leg turk on March 11, 2015, 02:29:17 PM
Quote from: vsmf2010 on March 11, 2015, 02:16:21 PM
Quote from: wrestler_73 on March 09, 2015, 09:10:33 PM
The chorus has begun once again...For those newer to the program we have been hearing this for two decades...We are young, just wait, have faith....BLAH BLAH BLAH.
INSANITY=same results over and over
I do not think this is completely accurate. UW was 2nd at the Big Ten tournament in 07 and 4th at the NCAA's in 2010. 2012 and 2013 were rough but things are definitely on the upswing. Several very high end recruits ended up not wrestling here and that has caused a setback for sure. The ones I am thinking of have not really had D1 success anywhere yet so I do not think you can put that on the coaching staff.
If you look back at previous coaches and the number of AA's there really is not a lot of difference. I would certainly think 3 AA's this year is a reasonable expectation. Consider that 3 or more has only happened 13 times before ever. If that happens you would have to consider this year a success historically. Just wanted to add some historical context.
George Martin
0,0,0,0,0,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,2,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,0
Duane Kleven 2.17 ave
0,0,1,1,3,3,3,4,4,5,1,1
Russ Hellickson 2.25 ave
1,5,2,1
Andy Rein 2.00 ave
2,3,2,1,1,3,2
Barry Davis 1.95 ave (2.5 ave over the last 6 years) (2.3 ave over the last decade)
2,2,2,2,2,2,1,3,2,1,1,0,2,2,2,2,3,4,4,1,1,2,?
OK, now what is the TEAMS average finish the last 20 years, in the big ten tourney, and NCAA tourney?
LOL, apparently as long as we have 2 AA's per year we are good. Pretty sure based on team finish, BD is in or near last on that list.
So you want to compare the program now to the program in the past when things were different amongst many other things including saying that some of those coaches were not getting it done either.
Why not compare the program to its peers? How do the recruiting classes compare? How do the final results compare?
I realize this is not all on the coach as you need university support and UW is behind in many things in terms of wrestling but lets compare to what other programs are doing.
Quote from: knight/purgolder on March 11, 2015, 06:58:55 PM
I also think there should be a new face for Wisconsin wrestling. Everyone that has access to Flowrestling should watch the Bo Jordan interview on why he chose Ohio State! Wish Donny P and Jared F were still around!
Why would they both still be here? Neither of them are at the job they left WI for. They both moved on to new opportunities and then moved on again. People/coaches have every right to work wherever they want but it is not always about the job they left.
Full disclosure I like Donny and Jared very much but they are not here and if you are a Badger fan I would think you would move on and support the coaches that are here.
There are fewer programs than in the old days competing for wrestlers so we should be able to have more top recruits. When there were 4 AA's two years in a row I would have expected that to be the new norm. Two guys transferred and that was a setback but having three excellent wrestlers and several average ones isn't what this program should accept.
Quote from: sudden_victory on March 11, 2015, 07:26:20 PM
Two guys transferred and that was a setback but having three excellent wrestlers and several average ones isn't what this program should accept.
I think it is stretch to classify Robertson an average wrestler. Right now, you could argue he is the best freshman in the country at his weight. That said, we do need more depth and we need more out of our instate talent.
Quote from: mkm13 on March 11, 2015, 07:48:49 PM
Quote from: sudden_victory on March 11, 2015, 07:26:20 PM
Two guys transferred and that was a setback but having three excellent wrestlers and several average ones isn't what this program should accept.
I think it is stretch to classify Robertson an average wrestler. Right now, you could argue he is the best freshman in the country at his weight. That said, we do need more depth and we need more out of our instate talent.
+1
There are lots of BD's in college wrestling, most of them are content to take the "glory" and surround themselves with Donny's and Jared's who recruit, coach, and wrestle. I think that the Stiener's were better than anyone, and wanted to stay. Maybe we should ask why all of these great coaches were ran out of town. I know, bring on the whining! If my kid was going pick a place to wrestle, I would want him to look for a coach at his weight that was still competing, or just off competition. Also, Minny, Iowa, Penn State, and Ohio State are MAKING national champs!!! It's not all about scholarships and money.
I'm guessing JRob, Tom Ryan and the Brands aren't getting out there much anymore. Kyle ruschell just did very well at the US Open and Trevor Brandvold isn't that far removed from high level competition.
Pretty sure Frayer is coaching at a club in Florida. He's the guy who I wish would have stayed. But he left for his alma mater.
Your right Kyle is on the same level as those others, but it does prove the point, I hear he's about 165#
Quote from: vsmf2010 on March 11, 2015, 02:16:21 PM
Quote from: wrestler_73 on March 09, 2015, 09:10:33 PM
The chorus has begun once again...For those newer to the program we have been hearing this for two decades...We are young, just wait, have faith....BLAH BLAH BLAH.
INSANITY=same results over and over
I do not think this is completely accurate. UW was 2nd at the Big Ten tournament in 07 and 4th at the NCAA's in 2010. 2012 and 2013 were rough but things are definitely on the upswing. Several very high end recruits ended up not wrestling here and that has caused a setback for sure. The ones I am thinking of have not really had D1 success anywhere yet so I do not think you can put that on the coaching staff.
If you look back at previous coaches and the number of AA's there really is not a lot of difference. I would certainly think 3 AA's this year is a reasonable expectation. Consider that 3 or more has only happened 13 times before ever. If that happens you would have to consider this year a success historically. Just wanted to add some historical context.
George Martin
0,0,0,0,0,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,2,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,0
Duane Kleven 2.17 ave
0,0,1,1,3,3,3,4,4,5,1,1
Russ Hellickson 2.25 ave
1,5,2,1
Andy Rein 2.00 ave
2,3,2,1,1,3,2
Barry Davis 1.95 ave (2.5 ave over the last 6 years) (2.3 ave over the last decade)
2,2,2,2,2,2,1,3,2,1,1,0,2,2,2,2,3,4,4,1,1,2,?
most of Kleven's and all of Martin's years of coaching only included a maximum of 6 places to make AA.
Also, because of weird bracketing, many "deserving" wrestlers didn't get wrestle-backs - in my opinion.