“Hot Topics in the Sport of Wrestling”

[aarons23]

What are all the problems of a co-op?

The only lost opportunities to wrestle in high school are when teams are dropped.  We are losing teams to more and more co-ops.  Instead of possibly having two teams with 11 weight classes and 22 varsity opportunities, we have one co-op with 14 weight classes plus all the problems of a co-op.

This trend is snowballing and going to get larger and larger which means fewer teams and this has a direct effect on smaller schools because it destroys there conferences for wrestling hurting everyone.

Thats my question also...I actually think the WIAA made a good choice in offering coops to struggling teams.

[CoachZ]

We added a school, this season, that doesn't offer wrestling. As of now we're giving six kids the opportunity to wrestle that otherwise wouldn't have a chance to. I don't see how that's a problem.

What are all the problems of a co-op?

The only lost opportunities to wrestle in high school are when teams are dropped.  We are losing teams to more and more co-ops.  Instead of possibly having two teams with 11 weight classes and 22 varsity opportunities, we have one co-op with 14 weight classes plus all the problems of a co-op.

This trend is snowballing and going to get larger and larger which means fewer teams and this has a direct effect on smaller schools because it destroys there conferences for wrestling hurting everyone.

Thats my question also...I actually think the WIAA made a good choice in offering coops to struggling teams.

[DocWrestling]

Co-ops are administrative nightmares.  They also seldom draw many wrestlers in from the non-host school.

Co-ops were created/allowed with the premise that it would help both programs until after time each school had their own program again.  That just does not happen.

Co-ops are often conference teams so the conference loses another wrestling member when two combine

[CoachZ]

So my co-op school would be better off starting their own team? Spend thousands of dollars in mats and equipment. Hire their own coaches and take those six kids and just have at it?

Again, our co-op doesn't offer wrestling. This is the only way for those kids to participate. Giving kids that chance can't be bad thing can it?

Co-ops are administrative nightmares.  They also seldom draw many wrestlers in from the non-host school.

Co-ops were created/allowed with the premise that it would help both programs until after time each school had their own program again.  That just does not happen.

Co-ops are often conference teams so the conference loses another wrestling member when two combine

[padre]

It seems we forget that the issue with filling a lineup is that you need 14 individuals that weigh a certain amount to fill your squad at regionals. This is what really separates us from other sports that can fill their lineups with the amount of individuals they need and don't have to worry about what they weigh. After a season there are always injuries and then with kids dropping at the end no doubt it is rough to fill. You may have 35 kids out for your team but that doesn't mean they are all separated in weight enough to fill. Maybe no one in the room is over 180 pounds.

That being said I don't know who should be responsible in saying a certain weight class should be cut because there are many variations in reasons why a team may only have 11 varsity kids at regionals. We don't know if kids quit, there were injuries or kids just were not separated in weight enough to fill the weights. We will have a few kids bunched together with 40 plus wins that don't have a for sure spot due to they haven't separated. Each team has their different reasonings why they aren't full but when you look at skinfolds it isn't always that they lack numbers.

[doublegotcha]

Don't knock the co-ops unless you have been involved.  I was the head coach of a co-op program for 12 years.  It can work very well if you are willing to be flexible.  Some years we got only a couple kids.  Some years we got more  These kids helped us fill our lineup and were great additions..  The only problem I see with co-ops is when they involved two schools with 1000 students each.

[Handles II]

Those are some very very interesting numbers that CLCfan and Ghetto have brought forth.

What would we do in football if 80% of teams couldn't consistently get 11 players on the field? Hint some schools already do this.

I know they are different sports, but you can play football with 10, or 9, or 8 players on the field, so why don't those schools with numbers issues simply do that rather than playing 9 man football?

I think if any sport consistently had the vast majority of their teams in all three divisions unable to fill a squad, the coaches, administrators and state (if not national governing body) would look at doing something different. Am I way off base with that statement?

I truly wish adding the 14th weight would have increased participation of our sport. I was all for it at the time it began. Now that we've had it for 15 years, can we say that it has done what it was supposed to do?

[Ghetto]

So my co-op school would be better off starting their own team? Spend thousands of dollars in mats and equipment. Hire their own coaches and take those six kids and just have at it?

Again, our co-op doesn't offer wrestling. This is the only way for those kids to participate. Giving kids that chance can't be bad thing can it?

Co-ops are administrative nightmares.  They also seldom draw many wrestlers in from the non-host school.

Co-ops were created/allowed with the premise that it would help both programs until after time each school had their own program again.  That just does not happen.

Co-ops are often conference teams so the conference loses another wrestling member when two combine

Co-ops are not a bad thing. However, they rarely help to bring both schools back from the dead. Usually the host school is fine, and the second (third) schools never come back as a stand alone program.

[boowrestle]

Did I rest a earlier comment correctly referring to schools co hoping together when both schools have enrollment around 1000 kids??? jmo,div1 size schools should not be co oping.

[ramjet]

Uea talk about a problem why in gods green earth would a Div 1 school have to CO-OP? That's a problem that should have an answer.

[DocWrestling]

The Green Bay co-ops have changed.  They used to have a program at all 4 high schools.

Then the co-ops were
Green Bay Preble/East
Green Bay West/Southwest

Now it is
Green Bay Preble
Green Bay West/East/Southwest

New Berlin has a co-op
Greendale/Whitnal have a co-op
Wauawatosa has a co-op
Cudahy/St.Francis have a co-op
Many of the Milwaukee city schools are big co-ops

Many more in D2 also

[Handles II]

Uea talk about a problem why in gods green earth would a Div 1 school have to CO-OP? That's a problem that should have an answer.

Because not enough kids are out for the sport in each school to field a full team, or one school has a program and the other doesn't but there are students who would like to wrestle.

Happens quite often in swimming, hockey, gymnastics, etc in D1 schools all over the state.

[DarkKnight]

It seems we forget that the issue with filling a lineup is that you need 14 individuals that weigh a certain amount to fill your squad at regionals. This is what really separates us from other sports that can fill their lineups with the amount of individuals they need and don't have to worry about what they weigh. After a season there are always injuries and then with kids dropping at the end no doubt it is rough to fill. You may have 35 kids out for your team but that doesn't mean they are all separated in weight enough to fill. Maybe no one in the room is over 180 pounds.

That being said I don't know who should be responsible in saying a certain weight class should be cut because there are many variations in reasons why a team may only have 11 varsity kids at regionals. We don't know if kids quit, there were injuries or kids just were not separated in weight enough to fill the weights. We will have a few kids bunched together with 40 plus wins that don't have a for sure spot due to they haven't separated. Each team has their different reasonings why they aren't full but when you look at skinfolds it isn't always that they lack numbers.

well said Padre. it is too hard to cut weight classes.

One school could have 5 good guys weighing 140-150, and they would go 126, 132, 138, 145, and 152.

another school could be stacked in the lower weights or upper weights with big kids.

there will always be something to complain about.

I like to see a regional set up for great wrestlers who just cant beat the guy ahead of him on the team, but could potentially place at the individual state tournament. I see some wrestlers wrestle JV that can place. one example, Last season Matt Anderson from Menomonee Falls was 24-0 and had beat Mason Phillips, but just couldn't beat Lasasanke (I butchered his name   ) , so he was not able to wrestle in the tournament series.

This year, however Matt Anderson will get the 106 spot and I think he is a darkhorse for the state title.