“Hot Topics in the Sport of Wrestling”

[CLC FAN]

I agree with hasbeen about this apparently being a hot topic.  Not sure why we are claiming this is a D3 problem only.  In the past 3 years, only 18 of 128 D1 schools have brought a full lineup to regionals every year.

In D2 that number is 12 that were full three years straight out of about 104 teams.

In D3 that number is 8 that were full three years straight out of about 104 teams.


Personally, I think both this and the jhi discussion (as well as several others) fall under a broader category: Do we want to focus on growing wrestling in Wisconsin as a team sport or as an individual sport?  I think that discussion will inform much of what should be attempted to improve WI High School wrestling.  If you want my opinion, it needs to be the team aspect that we focus on and promote.


Lastly, to aaraons's point about decision makers not liking us reducing weight classes - I would imagine those same decision makers aren't pleased with bussing kids 1hr 27 minutes for 16 athletes (8 on each team) to wrestle 4 matches.  Yes, that happened in WI last  year.  I picked an extreme case, but it took me all of 5 minutes of searching on trackwrestling to find it.

[aarons23]

Yes CLCfan you picked an extreme case...plus schools waste much more money than that on things that have no bearing on the students.   I always scratch my head when I see you pipe up about weigjt cutting.  You coach a school with smaller enrollment. ....you think outside the box....you have a successful program.   Its not easy but you get it done.....so why shouldn't other schools have success like yours? If it can be done in Random Lake it certainly can be done elsewhere.

[CLC FAN]

   I always scratch my head when I see you pipe up about weight cutting. 

I pipe up about reducing weight classes because I feel that having 14 weight classes hurts the sport.  I would guess that fewer weight classes would make it harder for my team to be successful,  but I think it would be better for the sport as a whole.

[go figure]

I have a question. Why don't colleges have more weight classes? They have thousands of athletes to recruit.

[Troy Grindle]

The numbers on track wrestling are screaming at people that 14 weight classes is to many for even an above average team to field a full team.  Only around 7% of all of the teams in the state can field a full team year after year for regionals and people don't think this is a problem?  At Waunakee for football very few kids don't start until their senior year, about 1/4 of the seniors playing football don't ever start.  Just because Waunakee could field two above average varsity teams should we get to have two varsity teams in the conference?  Or should the kids have to wait until they can crack the varsity lineup to play varsity football?  Or are we taking opportunities away from that kid to play varsity football because he can't make the first team? 

Just because a varsity caliber kid has to wrestle jv as a sophomore it isn't the worst thing in the word.  They probably aren't going to quit because of it and will gain a lot of confidence in their wrestling abilities.  Running a kid out on the mat as a freshman to wrestle varsity and watching him get his teeth kicked in is going to get him to quit or not come back.

11 weight classes, not growth allowance even for back to back days of wrestling.  Four divisions in wrestling evenly split between all of the teams.

105, 115, 125, 135, 140, 145, 155, 170, 185, 210, 285.  Good luck with cutting and maintaining weight with those weight classes with no growth allowance and back to back days of getting a lb.  3rd day of state for 135 is 135 not 140.

[Ghetto]

I pipe up about reducing weight classes because I feel that having 14 weight classes hurts the sport.  I would guess that fewer weight classes would make it harder for my team to be successful,  but I think it would be better for the sport as a whole.

(Drops mic. Walks off)

[imnofish]

I have a question. Why don't colleges have more weight classes? They have thousands of athletes to recruit.

...and limited resources.  Also, isn't this more consistent with international trends?  I don't see the rest of the world adding weight classes.

[aarons23]

   I always scratch my head when I see you pipe up about weight cutting. 

I pipe up about reducing weight classes because I feel that having 14 weight classes hurts the sport.  I would guess that fewer weight classes would make it harder for my team to be successful,  but I think it would be better for the sport as a whole.

so please tell me what's so special about Random Lake was your hard work you have built a successful program in a small school district. but you think it can't be done in other larger district? So either you think you have something special in Random Lake or you don't believe other districts are capable of working as hard as you?

[CLC FAN]

These don't taste like my words... I wonder what they are doing in my mouth.

[CoachZ]

I wouldn't mind seeing the season start until after Thanksgiving. Get through the end of football, the holiday, and hunting.

[aarons23]

These don't taste like my words... I wonder what they are doing in my mouth.

I just dont understand how you have the success you have had at a small enrollment school but think that cutting weight classes are good for the sport.  So logic tells me that you either have something special in Random Lake or you feel that other bigger districts can not work as hard as you?

So please tell us the secret to success in RL that others can not?

[CLC FAN]

So because you don't understand my point of view, I am therefore forced to believe one of two things?  I wasn't aware logic worked like that.  Let's look at it like this: just because we usually (though not this past year) can fill out a lineup doesn't mean I think that everyone who can't simply isn't working hard enough.  We didn't work any less hard this year than we have in the past, but I think we wrestled a full dual lineup less than half the time.  If there were 20 weight classes, Random Lake would never fill out a lineup... But I bet Rapids, Stoughton, Kaukauna, and maybe even a Stratford or Lomira could.  Would that mean that our coaching staff had just stopped working hard enough? 

Just to be clear, aarons, I don't expect you to share my opinion, but I do get a little sick of you telling me that I am wrong to hold the views I do.

[aarons23]

So because you don't understand my point of view, I am therefore forced to believe one of two things?  I wasn't aware logic worked like that.  Let's look at it like this: just because we usually (though not this past year) can fill out a lineup doesn't mean I think that everyone who can't simply isn't working hard enough.  We didn't work any less hard this year than we have in the past, but I think we wrestled a full dual lineup less than half the time.  If there were 20 weight classes, Random Lake would never fill out a lineup... But I bet Rapids, Stoughton, Kaukauna, and maybe even a Stratford or Lomira could.  Would that mean that our coaching staff had just stopped working hard enough?  

Just to be clear, aarons, I don't expect you to share my opinion, but I do get a little sick of you telling me that I am wrong to hold the views I do.

IMO Your wrong because you believe tearing down the sport is raising it up.  You worked hard to build a successful program....you thought outside the box on several occasions and you are a successful program. ....yet your still promoting tearing down the sport.  Its not always about filling every weight class....cutting weight classes would make programs like yours stronger but could and would hurt programs you compete with.  I dont for one minute think thats your intention. Wrestling isnt about giving up and taking the percieved easy road......its about taking on the challenge head on and working to be your best.....just like you did in RL. Cutting weight classes is the wrong approach....it smells of quiting and giving in. It takes opportunities away from high school kids ( which like it or not is what high school is about).  The arguement that college doesnt use 14 weights has nothing to do with high school opportunities. .....heck if high school participation goes up who knows....maybe that could change in college also.

You still haven't answered why could you build a successful program in RL but dont believe what you did in RL can be replicated in other places without cutting weight classes.

[dman]

I have a question...why do we think it is "bad" for the sport if we don't fill 14 weight classes?  Shouldn't the opportunities be there just in case and if they aren't, so be it?  Spend our efforts getting more participation in the great sport?  I am not saying I am 100% against going to 12 weight classes, but think we should focus on growing the sport first and if need be go to 12 classes then.

[Harris]

I wouldn't mind seeing the season start until after Thanksgiving. Get through the end of football, the holiday, and hunting.

One of the best suggestions I have seen in a while!