Youth Wrestling Tournaments- How to improve!

DocWrestling · January 28, 2020, 09:05:19 AM

1) Lunch Breaks- Don't take them. If you are not going to take them, advertise on your flier as I think it will improve your attendance.
2) Announce brackets night before on trackwrestling- This allows coaches to print out items they need to know with what mat and bracket each wrestler is on. Allows parents to walk in and find seating near the mat they are on.
3) Shorten up check-in time and start wrestling at 9am at the latest. Don't need an hour+ to check in wrestlers
4) Bracketing- do not change the trackwrestling default in weight difference to be more than 10%. You can adjust brackets if needed at end of each spectrum. Too many brackets with kids 10+ lbs different that weigh under or around 100 that did not have to be.
5) Team scores- Use Trackwrestling so all can follow.

If you use trackwrestling (everyone better be), get the bracketing done the night before, release to the public with mat assignments, bout numbers, etc, then families should be able to walk in, check in, and start wrestling.

Kudos to those tournaments that are using full mats, WIAA refs, and 90 second periods. Tournaments are so much better than they used to be but still many could take the next few steps to maximize everyone's time and experience.

Steve Heinzl · January 28, 2020, 10:06:54 AM

I got another one I was just talking about with my brother in law last night.

Place a greater emphasis on skill level separation within that 10% weight range. I've seen way to often where there is either a stacked bracket with 1 beginner or a beginner bracket with a State place finisher where you could easily make a better bracket for everyone and still be within 10% weight range. There's no faster way to get a new kid to quit then to go and get beat up on 3 or 4 times in a tournament. And the studs don't get anything out of it either.

wrastle63 · January 28, 2020, 10:16:43 AM

Keep parents in the stands and let the coaches coach. Make corners like HS tournaments and 2 people in the corner.

DocWrestling · January 28, 2020, 02:01:30 PM

Quote from: Steve Heinzl on January 28, 2020, 10:06:54 AM
I got another one I was just talking about with my brother in law last night.

Place a greater emphasis on skill level separation within that 10% weight range. I've seen way to often where there is either a stacked bracket with 1 beginner or a beginner bracket with a State place finisher where you could easily make a better bracket for everyone and still be within 10% weight range. There's no faster way to get a new kid to quit then to go and get beat up on 3 or 4 times in a tournament. And the studs don't get anything out of it either.

Tournament directors need to watch you tube videos on how to best set up brackets based on separation criteria with team name and talent levels.

I still would like to see more tournaments go by grade levels. My son is 2008 5th grader. It is crazy watching him wrestle 5th, 6th, and 7th graders while his 5th grade classmates that are 2 months younger and 2009 birth year wrestle 3rd, 4th, and 5th graders. Two friends and teammates, both in 5th grade separated by 2 months in age and one is wrestling a 7th grader and the other is wrestling a 3rd grader.

kpugh8680 · January 28, 2020, 02:07:48 PM

Flo is just as good as Track when it comes to bracketing.

padre · January 28, 2020, 02:10:48 PM

Quote from: kpugh8680 on January 28, 2020, 02:07:48 PM
Flo is just as good as Track when it comes to bracketing.

I agree with that. Only thing is thats all that its equal to with track.

kpugh8680 · January 28, 2020, 02:16:30 PM

Quote from: DocWrestling on January 28, 2020, 02:01:30 PM
Quote from: Steve Heinzl on January 28, 2020, 10:06:54 AM
I got another one I was just talking about with my brother in law last night.

Place a greater emphasis on skill level separation within that 10% weight range. I've seen way to often where there is either a stacked bracket with 1 beginner or a beginner bracket with a State place finisher where you could easily make a better bracket for everyone and still be within 10% weight range. There's no faster way to get a new kid to quit then to go and get beat up on 3 or 4 times in a tournament. And the studs don't get anything out of it either.

Tournament directors need to watch you tube videos on how to best set up brackets based on separation criteria with team name and talent levels.

I still would like to see more tournaments go by grade levels. My son is 2008 5th grader. It is crazy watching him wrestle 5th, 6th, and 7th graders while his 5th grade classmates that are 2 months younger and 2009 birth year wrestle 3rd, 4th, and 5th graders. Two friends and teammates, both in 5th grade separated by 2 months in age and one is wrestling a 7th grader and the other is wrestling a 3rd grader.

Oh but the parents that hold their child back from school and extra couple of years, so your 5th grader from 2008 is wrestling a 5th grader from 2006. Only being devils advocate Doc. My wife and I had these conversations too, when our son was in youth. He ran into kids up to 3 years older when we did grade, he will graduate when he is 17. We preferred birth year because it evened the wrestling field for him.

kpugh8680 · January 28, 2020, 02:19:03 PM

Quote from: padre on January 28, 2020, 02:10:48 PM
Quote from: kpugh8680 on January 28, 2020, 02:07:48 PM
Flo is just as good as Track when it comes to bracketing.

I agree with that. Only thing is thats all that its equal to with track.

Cannot argue Padre.

handsandtoes · January 28, 2020, 03:03:19 PM

I'm gonna play the devils advocate here.
1) Don't agree. The reason you run a tournament is for a fundraiser. So you need to take at least 1 break and get people to the concessions because that's how you make your money.
2) We tried that and the problem you run into is once kids (or should I say parents) see they have a tough match you get "no shows" And believe it or not kids (or parents) will lie about there weight. We even did a check scale and now you have kids weighing 10 more pounds then they signed up as. Now you have a mess trying to change brackets.
3) Goes hand and hand with #2
4) agree
5) agree

DocWrestling · January 28, 2020, 04:25:43 PM

Quote from: handsandtoes on January 28, 2020, 03:03:19 PM
I'm gonna play the devils advocate here.
1) Don't agree. The reason you run a tournament is for a fundraiser. So you need to take at least 1 break and get people to the concessions because that's how you make your money.
2) We tried that and the problem you run into is once kids (or should I say parents) see they have a tough match you get "no shows" And believe it or not kids (or parents) will lie about there weight. We even did a check scale and now you have kids weighing 10 more pounds then they signed up as. Now you have a mess trying to change brackets.
3) Goes hand and hand with #2
4) agree
5) agree

People have a ton of time to get to concessions without the break. Almost every tournament I go to has concessions items already sold out before they even get to the lunch break. No tournament has been running so fast that there is not time for food in between matches. Most say they need a break for the workers and refs. Ask them and they would tell you they would rather get done sooner and just bring them a water and bag of chips at some point. It is not that long of a day. Nothing wrong with workers and ref taking five minutes to go to bathroom and get a snack. Leave the table and come right back.

In regards to#2 above, if it is a fundraiser which it is then you should not care if they don't show up? You already have their money so what do you care if they show up. Many tournaments are running just like I described and change no brackets. If the kid is not the proper weight you just DQ him but no need to change brackets. Some tournaments don't even weigh in kids and have not had problems. The beauty of 5 man brackets is if a kid does not show up you still have 3 matches plus each wrestler already has a break.

I think it would be a better fundraiser if you had no breaks because more people would attend. I am quickly learning which to return to and which to not go back to.

At the very least if you take a break can you please keep all the kids off the mats.

chad1p · January 28, 2020, 07:49:56 PM

As a parent of a 1st year wrestler, I agree that it would be nice if most tournaments would create brackets based on skill level as well as weight. I understand that some tournaments, like state qualifiers should just be open. My sons first tournament was skill based. He both won and lost matches, but they were all pretty close. Most of the matches I watched were competitive. He had a great time. Last weekend we took him to one only based on weight and age and he didn't stand a chance in any his matches. As a parent, it was tough to watch. After his 3rd match, he told me he never wanted to wrestle in a tournament again. I take partial blame since I put him in this situation, but it seams like leveling the competition at the younger ages benefits all the kids. Give the newbies a chance to fall in love with the sport while the more advanced kids can battle it out against each other.

DocWrestling · January 28, 2020, 08:30:34 PM

To better match kids with similar age and ability you need a lot of wrestlers. How can we make that happen?

We have a lot of tournaments each weekend and many are in close proximity. They both end up with 60-80 kids in an age group.

I would really like to see more tournaments just do the two older age groups and other tournaments just do the two youngest age groups.

I think that would be a huge draw if tournaments did that. Imagine if we got 100+ in each age group. Much easier to split teammates and bracket by age and ability.

Does not have to be each weekend but I am pretty sure if there were more 5th-8th or 2005-2008 tournaments people would seek them out

asdfg · January 28, 2020, 08:31:10 PM

1) No K-2 or 2-4 grade brackets (no kids younger then 10). Absolutely no point (besides making money).

2) Must have USA coaches card to be matside. Only coaches matside.

3) No 1/4 mats.

NEW_Wrestling · January 28, 2020, 09:58:32 PM

My two cents worth:

My wrestler and I enjoyed the varity in the tournaments we went to. I think being original with your tournament will keep those that enjoy it coming back.

There are many great ways to make a tournament fun. Of course some will complain and unfortunately we don't hear from the majority that enjoy it.

As far as what is best for wrestling and growth of the sport, we need more events to develope those friendships. Kids seem to keep wrestling when they have a lot of friends doing the same. We should also try to find ways to keep it new and exciting. That includes variations in how tournaments are run.

From the 8 MSN unseeded brackets to the 4 Man round Robin where a large amount of attention is set to creating equal matches. We might even enjoy dual tournaments. The 24 man bracket double elimination for some of our more competitive kids. Beginners tournaments for our new kids. No head throws, no pins and no tears.

It's up to each parent and coach to decide if their younger kids are ready to compete. I don't think that can be a blanket statement. Every kid and situation is different.

I guess to sum up this very long post. Varity is the spice of all life.

padre · January 29, 2020, 02:29:13 AM

Quote from: handsandtoes on January 28, 2020, 03:03:19 PM
I'm gonna play the devils advocate here.
1) Don't agree. The reason you run a tournament is for a fundraiser. So you need to take at least 1 break and get people to the concessions because that's how you make your money.
2) We tried that and the problem you run into is once kids (or should I say parents) see they have a tough match you get "no shows" And believe it or not kids (or parents) will lie about there weight. We even did a check scale and now you have kids weighing 10 more pounds then they signed up as. Now you have a mess trying to change brackets.
3) Goes hand and hand with #2
4) agree
5) agree

You definitely DO NOT need a break!!! Parents and kids have an hour minimum between matches and that is when they generally eat. Much of the crowd hitting concessions during that break are the workers. We lean heavily to tournaments with either 0 break or very very short.