D2-195 OT

MARSHDOC · February 27, 2018, 09:20:00 PM

Quote from: bigoil on February 27, 2018, 09:11:59 PM
The guy won so thankfully it doesn't matter.

It kind of is like what is a catch in the NFL.

To me, it sure looks like control and feet in. Yes the foot did go out but that was after there was control and feet were both in. Maybe by rule that isn't a takedown, but that's like the eye test in the nfl, was it a catch and a one handed reach across the goal line, eye test that's a catch.

The officials have to make these calls in real time and this is why there are these questionable calls. I have stated repeatedly that they need to allow for a video challenge in these high profile matches. It would allow for more conclusive proof regarding the call. Why not make it mandatory for the state tournament and optional for other tournaments. This would take a big burden off the officials back and prevent threads like this.

MARSHDOC · February 27, 2018, 09:26:42 PM

Quote from: imnofish on February 27, 2018, 09:19:02 PM
All I know is that if I was as successful at QB as I am at ARMCHAIR QB, the Chicago Bears could have started me and won the Superbowl this year.

Look fish, these kids work year round to get a shot at winning the big show. Until they fix the system and take the entire burden off of a single referee (use modern technology) you are going to have to deal with 'ARMCHAIR QBs'.

imnofish · February 27, 2018, 09:59:04 PM

Quote from: MARSHDOC on February 27, 2018, 09:26:42 PM
Quote from: imnofish on February 27, 2018, 09:19:02 PM
All I know is that if I was as successful at QB as I am at ARMCHAIR QB, the Chicago Bears could have started me and won the Superbowl this year.

Look fish, these kids work year round to get a shot at winning the big show. Until they fix the system and take the entire burden off of a single referee (use modern technology) you are going to have to deal with 'ARMCHAIR QBs'.

Even with added modern technology, they will still exist. People still complain about college calls. Of course, I would love to see the best calls made every time, but we are dealing with human beings here... none of whom are perfect. They are trying their best to be perfect, though.

bigG · February 28, 2018, 09:49:23 AM

This is why we should willingly let AI take over. Our human foible shouldn't be tolerated.

Replay or not, the will be plenty to P&M about.

DocWrestling · February 28, 2018, 10:05:19 AM

Can we be honest and realize that high school wrestling is never going to have video review? Can you imagine the expense and hassle? And there will still be debate.

Schools did not even have enough money for basketball shot clocks. Just don't see video entering the high school realm any time soon.

Coach V · February 28, 2018, 10:20:34 AM

OR, we realize bad calls or calls we don't like, or bad decisions, are part of life. Move on. We can't go back and fix everything everyday that might not be right. Real life isn't always fair. Score more points or do something different earlier so your not in that position. I am the first one to dig my heels in when I think its wrong so I understand.

wrestle09 · February 28, 2018, 10:31:42 AM

Watching the match this was clearly the right call. Larson did initially have both feet in but did not cement them both in through the throw. In fact, within a 1 second period the foot when from in to out to back in. It was a heck of a throw and attempt to keep his feet in but the call made was the correct one.

At 52 seconds he initiated the throw:

He lands with his feet inbounds at 51 seconds:

Still at 51 seconds he has both feet out of bounds:

DocWrestling · February 28, 2018, 11:06:52 AM

WOW and LOL! Those pictures right there tell you how tough it is to be an official and we should respect them for doing what they do!

imnofish · February 28, 2018, 12:20:12 PM

Quote from: DocWrestling on February 28, 2018, 11:06:52 AM
WOW and LOL! Those pictures right there tell you how tough it is to be an official and we should respect them for doing what they do!

Exactly right!

DocWrestling · February 28, 2018, 12:49:04 PM

Big issues in all sports
1) Fewer kids participating
2) Fewer people becoming officials
3) Fewer people going into coaching

Will have a big impact on how sports are operated. And will affect rural areas more than urban areas and will affect less affluent districts more

imnofish · February 28, 2018, 01:26:21 PM

Quote from: DocWrestling on February 28, 2018, 12:49:04 PM
Big issues in all sports
1) Fewer kids participating
2) Fewer people becoming officials
3) Fewer people going into coaching

Will have a big impact on how sports are operated. And will affect rural areas more than urban areas and will affect less affluent districts more

Excellent points, Doc. At some point, fans need to be held responsible for their actions.

briggs · February 28, 2018, 01:54:43 PM

The WIAA has chosen how they want to pick officials for the tourney. It has very little to do with rankings , otherwise they could just choose from the top 15 to 20 ranked officials and go from there. This is another reason younger officials will not stick with officiating. There were some good officials there but several that should have been in a beer-belly contest. Seriously, out of shape, out of position and so on. This is just one of many things Wisconsin HAS to change for our sport to evolve.

Stripes · February 28, 2018, 02:10:39 PM

Wrestle09 that is an awesome job with those pics. This should start some dialogue. At 51 seconds, his feet were in. At 51 seconds(next frame) his feet were out. How long do his feet need to be in for in order to call it a takedown? He was on top, opponent was on his back and larsons feet were in..,. For a moment. Does dragging toes count in wrestling like the NFL? Any refs on here care to share their opinion?

DocWrestling · February 28, 2018, 02:13:30 PM

Quote from: briggs on February 28, 2018, 01:54:43 PM
The WIAA has chosen how they want to pick officials for the tourney. It has very little to do with rankings , otherwise they could just choose from the top 15 to 20 ranked officials and go from there. This is another reason younger officials will not stick with officiating. There were some good officials there but several that should have been in a beer-belly contest. Seriously, out of shape, out of position and so on. This is just one of many things Wisconsin HAS to change for our sport to evolve.

I really do not now how officials are selected but I hear this complaint from officials in all sports. Not sure why this process in rating and ranking is not more transparent to all. If it was more tranparent, coaches would participate more in the process because they have an inherent interest to get the best officials to state and refs would do more to move up the rankings.

This process should be open so all understand. Can officials see where they are ranked? Can coaches see where officials are ranked?

First thing I would do is put numbers on the backs of all officials so there was a roster and made it easier for coaches to rate officials they don't normally see. Seems like it would be easy to create a phone app for rating officials to make it easy on coaches and officials

bigoil · February 28, 2018, 02:19:06 PM

Quote from: Stripes on February 28, 2018, 02:10:39 PM
Wrestle09 that is an awesome job with those pics. This should start some dialogue. At 51 seconds, his feet were in. At 51 seconds(next frame) his feet were out. How long do his feet need to be in for in order to call it a takedown? He was on top, opponent was on his back and larsons feet were in..,. For a moment. Does dragging toes count in wrestling like the NFL? Any refs on here care to share their opinion?

That's my point...what is a takedown is becoming as unclear as what is a catch?

Feet in (how long)? He had control per the eye test but that may not be the correct interpretation of the rule.

Ankle hooked, crowd yells 2, hold on, ref hasn't awarded two yet or at all in some cases.