A couple questions for discussion:
1- Why on earth did these athletes not receive their WIAA third place medal? You take away their trip to state and can't give them a $2 medal?
2- Why isn't there a memo out that these wrestlers should be considered state qualifiers but not state participants. You can reward one achievement without giving the other. Covid 19 is the only reason they don't get to PARTICIPATE at state why aren't they being recognized for their achievement separate from that? Every kid that got third last year got their name on a state qualifier board everywhere but these kids they get to wrestle a quarter of the matches as normal and get told tough luck kid every other year you made it? Disappointing and wrong on so many levels. What do others think?
Quote from: Preparewrestlingcoach on February 07, 2021, 06:37:07 PM
A couple questions for discussion:
1- Why on earth did these athletes not receive their WIAA third place medal? You take away their trip to state and can't give them a $2 medal?
2- Why isn't there a memo out that these wrestlers should be considered state qualifiers but not state participants. You can reward one achievement without giving the other. Covid 19 is the only reason they don't get to PARTICIPATE at state why aren't they being recognized for their achievement separate from that? Every kid that got third last year got their name on a state qualifier board everywhere but these kids they get to wrestle a quarter of the matches as normal and get told tough luck kid every other year you made it? Disappointing and wrong on so many levels. What do others think?
Extremely poor decision with no thought about the kids, which is where the thought should be. Unfortunately Wade could care less.
Could a "correction" be filled by WIAA after the season that these athletes should be recognized by their schools as state qualifiers?
Quote from: padre on February 07, 2021, 06:40:58 PM
Quote from: Preparewrestlingcoach on February 07, 2021, 06:37:07 PM
A couple questions for discussion:
1- Why on earth did these athletes not receive their WIAA third place medal? You take away their trip to state and can't give them a $2 medal?
2- Why isn't there a memo out that these wrestlers should be considered state qualifiers but not state participants. You can reward one achievement without giving the other. Covid 19 is the only reason they don't get to PARTICIPATE at state why aren't they being recognized for their achievement separate from that? Every kid that got third last year got their name on a state qualifier board everywhere but these kids they get to wrestle a quarter of the matches as normal and get told tough luck kid every other year you made it? Disappointing and wrong on so many levels. What do others think?
Extremely poor decision with no thought about the kids, which is where the thought should be. Unfortunately Wade could care less.
I keep hearing the wiaa is cashed strapped. Guess they should worry about managing their money instead of taking up their time making really in needed rules!
Just my two sense. The amount of qualifiers from each sectional was determined before the start of the tournament series. It sucks for the athletes that got third, however coaches and athletes new the stakes going in to sectionals. You can't go back and make everyone who took 3rd before the change from top 2 to top 3 and make them a state qualifier and you can't do it for this year either.
Quote from: RockVikings on February 07, 2021, 08:48:11 PM
Just my two sense. The amount of qualifiers from each sectional was determined before the start of the tournament series. It sucks for the athletes that got third, however coaches and athletes new the stakes going in to sectionals. You can't go back and make everyone who took 3rd before the change from top 2 to top 3 and make them a state qualifier and you can't do it for this year either.
Sad but true. Going into sectionals everyone knew what the rules were. Sucks I agree
Prepwrestlingcoach is spot on. These young men should still be recognized as state qualifiers. They should also receive the third place medal. If the WIAA doesn't or can't afford the medals... let me know... I'm sure we can help out.
Quote from: aarons23 on February 07, 2021, 10:25:40 PM
Prepwrestlingcoach is spot on. These young men should still be recognized as state qualifiers. They should also receive the third place medal. If the WIAA doesn't or can't afford the medals... let me know... I'm sure we can help out.
Do you give 3rd and 4th from D1 as they are missing two qualifiers per sectional?
Nice gesture for sure...
Quote from: bigoil on February 07, 2021, 10:41:01 PM
Quote from: aarons23 on February 07, 2021, 10:25:40 PM
Prepwrestlingcoach is spot on. These young men should still be recognized as state qualifiers. They should also receive the third place medal. If the WIAA doesn't or can't afford the medals... let me know... I'm sure we can help out.
Do you give 3rd and 4th from D1 as they are missing two qualifiers per sectional?
Nice gesture for sure...
Ultimately we should keep it as close to normal as possible... so yes we would.
I would agree...the WIAA should announce that third placers in D2 and D3 as well as 3rd and 4th place winners in D1 earned the right to be NAMED state qualifiers and recognized as such by their local schools citing that COVID is the only reason they did not get to qualify for the state meet. Simple gesture. Saves face. Would get them love in the press. Just seems too easy to me!
I like this idea.
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
I take it none of your wrestlers got third? ;D
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Thank you for putting into words what I have been thinking for weeks.
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Perfectly written. Years down the road these men can say I would have made state if it wasn't for that bleepin covid.
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Every life lesson doesn't need a negative connotation... the life lesson could be in trying times the adults still care enough to recognize young adults accomplishments even when they don't get the normal practice of being able to further compete. Kindness, compassion and understanding is also a great life lesson in these trying times.
This brings back memories. how many more state qualifiers I would have had back in the day when only 2 made it to state. Had many kids sitting in third that coulda, woulda, shoulda. Most are all growed up and great adults but we stiil talk about what could of been if they wrestlrd now.
Quote from: aarons23 on February 08, 2021, 09:54:44 AM
Quote from: wrestle09 on February 08, 2021, 08:26:42 AM
As a wrestling community we always talk about how high school sports are a teacher of life lessons with wrestling being one of the best teachers. As a wrestler you are responsible for your performance on the mat. If you lose you lose out there by yourself. We tell our kids that things won't always go their way. It might be a "blown" call by a ref, a crappy tournament draw, being in a loaded sectional, or numerous other scenarios. We tell them that when these scenarios arise you can only control what you can control, that they have to make the best of every situation, and that life isn't always fair. We say these things year after year.
Now we're in a year unlike any other and we sit on the forums and inappropriate term1 about how unfair things are and go against everything we've said for years that wrestling teaches. The funny thing is that I did not hear my wrestlers complain about any of it. They've spent the whole season working and taking every opportunity they got. When it came time for regionals they knew that half the kids that normally qualify for sectionals wouldn't make it through. Knowing this they went to work to be one of the top two guys instead of complaining. They exemplified everything we have told them this sport teaches them while many of us did not.
Would I rather have 16/12 kids going to the sate tournament? You bet. Does it suck that some kids missed an opportunity to qualify for state because they took 3rd at sectionals? Absolutely. But, like we have told our kids for years, life isn't always fair and the only thing you can do is keep in the future.
Every life lesson doesn't need a negative connotation... the life lesson could be in trying times the adults still care enough to recognize young adults accomplishments even when they don't get the normal practice of being able to further compete. Kindness, compassion and understanding is also a great life lesson in these trying times.
Double edged sword there. Yes something of note should have been thought of I agree.
Crowning a champ is what it is about in the wiaa.
Quote from: aarons23 on February 08, 2021, 09:54:44 AM
Every life lesson doesn't need a negative connotation... the life lesson could be in trying times the adults still care enough to recognize young adults accomplishments even when they don't get the normal practice of being able to further compete. Kindness, compassion and understanding is also a great life lesson in these trying times.
I agree to an extent. I look at what the Woodland Conference did as I great example of showing understanding and compassion. It was easy to simply forget the conference tournaments this year but they put in the work to find a way to give the kids an opportunity to win a conference title. I don't agree that we should call kids that missed the state tournament based on the rules this year state qualifiers. How often, in a normal year, is there a podium-worthy kid sitting in the stands at the Kohl Center who would have made the tournament in a different sectional but just because happened to be in one with the top 2 or 3 guys.
Quote from: Preparewrestlingcoach on February 08, 2021, 09:04:14 AM
I take it none of your wrestlers got third? ;D
None took third at sectionals but we had plenty that took third at our regional who, in my opinion, were state-caliber wrestlers that either had a bad match or were behind two studs. In a normal year they would have made it to the next round and had a chance still to qualify for the tournament. It sucks and I feel bad for those kids but I didn't hear any of them complain. They knew what they had to do to keep their chance of qualifying alive and simply fell short and were back in the room that Monday working towards next year.
Agree with everything you said wrestle09. I know saying at least they found a way to crown champions is not the popular saying. But it is true. Especially in D1. It was hard to get those schools to host. A lot of those schools don't have students at them. My son was a senior last year. He passed on wrestling, and a chance for a fourth straight team state berth, to focus on tennis. Yes, he was the wrestling tennis combo. Beat everyone he played last winter, even coaches in our area. Had a real shot to go to state, no season. Has he moved on, yep. Did it suck, yep. Now he focuses on school. Because there is a lot of life left. Maybe some of us parents need to focus on smaller things. And next year, we start with the tournament we have had, and keep pushing for 16 in all divisions and double elimination.
Can we move this Topic to the CRY ME A RIVER PAGE?
Quote from: MatScoutWillie on February 08, 2021, 12:08:29 PM
Can we move this Topic to the CRY ME A RIVER PAGE?
Its a forum, and its a discussion. We dont need to agree but dont be rude.
Quote from: MatScoutWillie on February 08, 2021, 12:08:29 PM
Can we move this Topic to the CRY ME A RIVER PAGE?
Not unless I can be considered a state qualifier for taking 3rd at sectionals in 1998.
Quote from: SayHey42 on February 08, 2021, 12:35:25 PM
Quote from: MatScoutWillie on February 08, 2021, 12:08:29 PM
Can we move this Topic to the CRY ME A RIVER PAGE?
Not unless I can be considered a state qualifier for taking 3rd at sectionals in 1998.
Done! ;D ;D ;D ;D
I am only 25 when is the last time only 2 wrestlers qualified from sectional in D 2/3?? Since I was 13 years old and my brother was qualifying for state the norm, the expectation to earn the ACHIEVEMENT of being a State Qualifier has been placing third at the sectional meet. These individuals met that expectation. They can be considered Qualifiers without being participants. COVID is limiting the number of people aloud in the building it should not limit the amount of people recognized for meeting the regularized expectation for qualifying for the state meet.
If it changes to 2 forevermore that argument just like the argument for saying you got 3rd at a great regional is irrelevant. However in the here and now, in my wrestling lifetime, this blip on the radar change to 2 is due to CAPACITY and not due to the WIAA deeming a athlete who got 3rd less accomplished than any of the previous 12 years.
The tournament is meant to determine who number 1 is yes!! But numbers 9 through 12 can still be recognized as meeting the expectation to qualify.
The wresters were more than aware of the implications of 1st and 2nd place finishes heading into the weekend.
You can not go back and change the rules retroactively, as if it were announced before hand. When in fact it it had been announced before hand it would have created a much different reality for the matches through the 8 man bracket.
The season is different, the rules are different, the WIAA completely screwed up the season and the format of the state series; it is what it is.
Quote from: Preparewrestlingcoach on February 08, 2021, 01:12:51 PM
I am only 25 when is the last time only 2 wrestlers qualified from sectional in D 2/3?? Since I was 13 years old and my brother was qualifying for state the norm, the expectation to earn the ACHIEVEMENT of being a State Qualifier has been placing third at the sectional meet. These individuals met that expectation. They can be considered Qualifiers without being participants. COVID is limiting the number of people aloud in the building it should not limit the amount of people recognized for meeting the regularized expectation for qualifying for the state meet.
If it changes to 2 forevermore that argument just like the argument for saying you got 3rd at a great regional is irrelevant. However in the here and now, in my wrestling lifetime, this blip on the radar change to 2 is due to CAPACITY and not due to the WIAA deeming a athlete who got 3rd less accomplished than any of the previous 12 years.
The tournament is meant to determine who number 1 is yes!! But numbers 9 through 12 can still be recognized as meeting the expectation to qualify.
2001 was when they went to 12 man brackets from the 8 used previously.
Quote from: babywhales on February 08, 2021, 01:35:10 PM
The wresters were more than aware of the implications of 1st and 2nd place finishes heading into the weekend.
You can not go back and change the rules retroactively, as if it were announced before hand. When in fact it it had been announced before hand it would have created a much different reality for the matches through the 8 man bracket.
The season is different, the rules are different, the WIAA completely screwed up the season and the format of the state series; it is what it is.
So in real life, after you make a mistake you can't go back and try to make the right of the situation? The WIAA has the opportunity to do that. Everyone earlier said this situation is just like real life sometimes you can be that bad guy and apologize...sidenote thanks for the refernence who said it switched in 2001. 20 years of precedent was set. I feel every single one of these kids should be recognized by their local schools as qualifiers and that the WIAA should step up and acknowledge them as well. That's just the opinion of another has been though!
One of my guys took third. It'll make him a better wrestler/man down the road. So often parents complain that this or that will have a lasting impact on the kid. Might be; but a lasting impact is often positive when a kid has to face the realities of not quite making it. Work a little harder. Improve technique, more mat time, etc.
Quote from: bigG on February 08, 2021, 03:23:40 PM
One of my guys took third. It'll make him a better wrestler/man down the road. So often parents complain that this or that will have a lasting impact on the kid. Might be; but a lasting impact is often positive when a kid has to face the realities of not quite making it. Work a little harder. Improve technique, more mat time, etc.
Hopefully the seniors will take your advice.🤷♀️🤷♀️
The reason for three qualifiers was because WISAA and the WIAA combined which created more schools.
Were there schools who did not participate in their regional due to COVID 19?
Lets be thankful that for the wrestling season to have a post season, especially for the kids that are going for their 2nd, 3rd or 4th title.
I'm just as excited for kids going for their first title! The past winners have already tasted glory. There are a lot of good seniors that now have the chance to win a state title.
Quote from: padre on February 08, 2021, 06:09:17 PM
Quote from: bigG on February 08, 2021, 03:23:40 PM
One of my guys took third. It'll make him a better wrestler/man down the road. So often parents complain that this or that will have a lasting impact on the kid. Might be; but a lasting impact is often positive when a kid has to face the realities of not quite making it. Work a little harder. Improve technique, more mat time, etc.
Hopefully the seniors will take your advice.🤷♀️🤷♀️
The reason for three qualifiers was because WISAA and the WIAA combined which created more schools.
Yeah, I remember that.